Episode 359: Your Urban Legends LXXXIV - We Demand Answers
/Halloween is just around the corner, so naturally it’s time to hear some urban legends! We demand more answers, we respect the survival instincts of Australian teens, and we talk about the worst things to hear a sleep-talker say.
Content Warning: This episode contains conversations about or mentions of abduction, car accidents, death, and break-ins.
Housekeeping
- Recommendation: This week, Amanda recommends Number Go Up by Zeke Faux
- Books: Check out our previous book recommendations, guests’ books, and more at spiritspodcast.com/books
- Call to Action: Check out Multitude’s newest show, Big Game Hunger!
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Find Us Online
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Cast & Crew
- Co-Hosts: Julia Schifini and Amanda McLoughlin
- Editor: Brandon Grugle
- Music: Brandon Grugle, based on "Danger Storm" by Kevin MacLeod
- Artwork: Allyson Wakeman
- Multitude: multitude.productions
About Us
Spirits is a boozy podcast about mythology, legends, and folklore. Every episode, co-hosts Julia and Amanda mix a drink and discuss a new story or character from a wide range of places, eras, and cultures. Learn brand-new stories and enjoy retellings of your favorite myths, served over ice every week, on Spirits.
Transcript
[theme]
AMANDA: Welcome to Spirits Podcast, a boozy dive into mythology, legends, and folklore. Every week we pour a drink and learn about a new story from around the world. I'm Amanda.
JULIA: And I'm Julia.
AMANDA: And this is your Hometown Urban Legends capping off the spookiest month of the year.
JULIA: That's the sound of ghosts.
AMANDA: I love that. I love that ghosts are using those iPhone apps from the early to mid-late 2000s, you know?
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Ghosts super into rap air horns.
AMANDA: Now, Julia, this is not the last Hometown Urban Legends episode that our patrons are going to receive, because—
JULIA: No.
AMANDA: —we talk about this in the mid-roll most of the time, but hey, if you support the show on Patreon, as little as four bucks a month, you get a whole extra episode every dang month, where we read more Urban Legends. And, Julia, we publish those on the last day of the month, which you want to guess what that is every October?
JULIA: Is that Halloween, baby?
AMANDA: Halloween, baby. So for probably the third or fourth year in a row, we get to spend Halloween with the conspirators, releasing a brand-new your Urban Legends episode for them on the spooky day, our day.
JULIA: Yeah. Amanda, we also haven't recorded that yet. And for people who are not subscribed to the Patreon and haven't experienced those, we started doing video elements for that. Amanda, do you want to dress up for the next hometown video?
AMANDA: Fuck yeah! I'll do it in costume. That sounds great.
JULIA: Amazing. All right. So if you want to actually spend Halloween with us and see us in Halloween costumes on Halloween, reading urban legends, sign up for the Patreon.
AMANDA: Yes. You get the audio at any level and you get the video, as well as ad-free episodes, by the way, at the $8 a month level or above. So sign up, get in there, enjoy, join. It's a fabulous idea. Can't wait.
JULIA: I think you're gonna enjoy it, and I'm so excited that I just realized we could dress up for that because—
AMANDA: Yay.
JULIA: —video.
AMANDA: And you have some great costumes to show off this year, so it's gonna be an epic one.
JULIA: I do, I do.
AMANDA: Julia, speaking of epic ones—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —we got a follow up email, which already some of our favorite emails from listeners are episode follow up.
JULIA: I do love a follow up.
AMANDA: This one comes from April, she/her, and wrote in just hours really after we released episode 353 back in September. And so April wrote in the subject line, "Episode 353. Mikayla is my soon-to-be sister."
JULIA: What?
AMANDA: Right?
JULIA: What? A family element?
AMANDA: Here we go. April says, "Longtime listener, been listening to your podcasts since the first dozen episodes."
JULIA: Whoa. April, thank you,
AMANDA: April, that is a really long time, and of course, sharing it. "I wanted to write in to share that Mikayla will be my sister in about nine months and her brother Jake is my fiancé.
JULIA: Whoa! Shoutout to marrying Jakes.
AMANDA: Shoutout to marrying Jakes. "I do want you to withhold judgment slightly, as we go through this email."
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: May I ask—
JULIA: I'll allow it.
AMANDA: Okay.
JULIA: We'll see.
AMANDA: April continues, "I was floored to hear this story, because she didn't tell me she wrote in and it took me by surprise."
JULIA: Hmm.
AMANDA: It was so eerie to be listening to this urban legend and begin to think, "Oh, my God, this sounds like my soon-to-be family. Mikayla reached out and told me it was them in the episode today. And I had to reach out because the house she talks about is the house I currently live in.
JULIA: Oh, no.
AMANDA: Okay, we have two more senses to get through. "I've not had anything as intense as Mikayla's experience happened while living there myself."
JULIA: Hmm.
AMANDA: "But there have been little things." Okay, final sentence. "With the spooky season upon us, I will be extra aware of the noises in the house since the man might still be biding his time."
JULIA: April, April, have you been listening to the show? Since the first dozen episodes according to you.
AMANDA: April, you know us, you've grown up with us.
JULIA: April, April, why would you live in the house with the man, that the man wants to steal? Why is he still living there? Is my question. And why did you go along with it?
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Clearly, you knew the story before Mikayla wrote it in and you heard it on the podcast.
AMANDA: Yup.
JULIA: Why would you agree to that?
AMANDA: So we understand that housing is expensive, okay? We're in a housing crisis right now. We understand you'll do lots of things for a man you love, especially in Julia's case because her man's name is Jake.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: We get it. However, April, we need you to be taking some precautions, okay? We need you to get some sustainable and non-appropriative, you know, herbs sachets. You know, little things you can carry around, some salt lines.
JULIA: Big fan of rosemary and lavender. Those are great use. Those—
AMANDA: Exactly.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Exactly. Call your nanas and your aunties and say, "Hey, just, you know, I'm gonna ward away anything bad going on." And, you know, make sure your particular tradition is working with you here."
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: "I am concerned about you and I do need you to report back if anything spooky occurs."
JULIA: April, I'm concerned about you getting in the middle of the situation because if The Man— and we're using the— the big letters. We're using capitalized T and M in that. If The Man almost got Mikayla, The Man could almost get you. And clearly, Jake is the one that he is after.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Why would your fiancé not leave that house? Why would he move back in? I don't understand. If I knew something, like, malevolent figure was trying to get me since high school— also, April, I want you to write back in and explain to us like, what did Jake do to get this man, The Man, to follow him and come for him?
AMANDA: You must have theories, okay?
JULIA: Look, I— you have to ask him, be like, "Hey, did you, like, fuck with a Ouija board? Was there something like Satanic Panic Dungeons and Dragons stuff happening here? Like, why— Why? What happened? What happened?
AMANDA: Yeah, but was there like a man that tried to abduct you as a child and you got away from him? And now, like he is haunting you from the afterlife. Like, April, you sound smart. You and Mikayla listen to the show. You know enough to know that something's going on here.
JULIA: I need more answers. I need more answers.
AMANDA: I need more answers.
JULIA: I— and now that we have two listeners who know this story, I want to see an email from Jake himself next. Dammit.
AMANDA: Yup, I'll go ahead— Julia, I'll offer a first for spirits.
JULIA: Oh.
AMANDA: I will talk to Jake.
JULIA: I would take a voice memo from Jake.
AMANDA: I would take a voicemail from Jake or a—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: —phone conversation with Jake where we can then edit his, you know, responses and— you know, listen, guys, it's not easy being a podcaster over here. Ask Jake some questions—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —or at least get some audio testimony from Jake—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: —about why he feels safe laying his head down each night with his fiancée and then inviting his sibling over to a very clearly haunted house.
JULIA: I don't— I don't get it, but I need to know and you people are the only ones with the answers. So give them to me!
AMANDA: I am so glad that you have each other. I am so glad that you Mikayla and April listen to Spirits, because y'all need to. And it is so heartwarming that two soon-to-be sisters-in-law both enjoy this podcast. Thank you so much.
JULIA: If the parents are around, I want to know what they know about the situation.
Anyway—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —there's just so many unanswered questions.
AMANDA: Pop the phone on the kitchen table, put it on a voice memo, and say, "Hey, soon-to-be mother-in-law, when did you first notice that Jake attracts spooky shit to him?"
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Let's see what happens.
JULIA: I just want— I want to know everything. I want to know everything.
AMANDA: Incredible, incredible feedback. Incredible diligence, April. Incredible groundwork here. Mikayla. We have some questions for Jake.
JULIA: Yes. Well, Amanda, I have a story that I think, based on the length of this email, does answer a lot of questions that are probably posed in the email.
AMANDA: Oh, I love that.
JULIA: So I'm going to tell you a story here from Zephyr, she/her. Titled Ghosts of Caravan Parks past, Terrified Teenagers and Ghost Blindness.
AMANDA: Oh, hell yeah.
JULIA: All right. So Zephyr writes, "Hello, Spirits team and fellow conspirators. If you're reading this, I guarantee I am squealing in excitement, so thank you for that. And also everything else you do. I've been so interested in mythology, I was a Percy Jackson kid, and paranormal stuff for so long that seeing— or rather hearing a podcast that takes a feminist view on it is so exciting."
AMANDA: Thank you.
JULIA: "I hope you enjoy. A fair warning, this email will probably be long. Sorry." I love a long email. Personally, I love a long email.
AMANDA: We love it. And also we— we screen the emails for the length we need. So if we see a long one, we're like, "Ooh, yeah."
JULIA: Hmm.
AMANDA: "That's a juicy one, baby."
JULIA: We love a juicy, juicy story. "So a little background for context, I'm homeschooled, Australian, and apparently ghost blind."
AMANDA: Incredible.
JULIA: "For the purposes of the story, I shall be known as Zephyr. A name that was in the running for my legal name until my dad decided on something very much less cool. And when I was 14, I had a weird-ass experience that firmly concreted my previously dubious belief in ghosts. Now, being homeschooled is interesting to say the least. I love it. But my favorite things are the homeschool camps. Five or so days in a caravan park at a predetermined location with your best friends, brilliant and occasionally chaotic. But, hey, what do you expect? You can't put a group of teenagers together and think that they won't try and make some small, harmless explosions from ping pong balls, sparkler powder, and tin foil." Homeschooled kids.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Some of the most interesting people, I feel like.
AMANDA: So cute, so cute.
JULIA: You're just trying things that you wouldn't get away with in a— a regular school, and I love that for you. I love that for you. "So with a shred of that context and without further ado, I give you my creepy cool, primarily creepy story. It was at one such homeschool camp in the summer of 2019, pre-pandemic, when the paranormal event occurred. This particular camp was at Lorne, a popular touristy beach town right on the Great Ocean Road. It was the day after the formal end of the group, but a few of us have decided to stay an extra day, four of us and our families to be exact. And for these purposes, they shall be known as Summer, female, age 17. River, male, age 15. Mary, female, age 13, and me, Zephyr, female, age 14."
AMANDA: Okay, incredible. Thank you for the pseudonyms. It is always stressful when we don't know if you are using pseudonyms or not, and then your brother-in-law, Jake, hears it on the podcast. So thank you very much.
JULIA: That also means Zephyr is probably around 18 right now, so that's like a little good context for us. We're dealing with a Gen Z-er here and that's fine.
AMANDA: Exactly.
JULIA: We love— we love when the Gen Z write in, we do.
AMANDA: We do. Also, like I— listen, I couldn't know less about Percy Jackson, y'all. So I— I could tell from there that Zephyr was younger than us, but knowing her approximate pop culture knowledge is helpful here.
JULIA: Yes. "So we were all at the caravan park, just us teens, chillin' out, eating camp food, which includes two-minute noodles or as Americans incorrectly equate it, instant ramen." It is technically not instant, because you do have to wait, so—
AMANDA: Julia, we're going to just pull over here as I—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —do a little Google, two-minute noodles.
JULIA: I think she means like cup of noodle, you know?
AMANDA: But it sounds like— it sounds like Zephyr is saying that this is a distinct product as opposed to our instant ramen.
JULIA: Oh, okay. Australians, tell us if two-minute noodles is a different thing from, like, our cup of noodle instant ramen situation.
AMANDA: So I'm seeing— there's like— there's a curry flavor.
JULIA: Ah.
AMANDA: A masala flavor.
JULIA: Hmm. We need more masala flavored instant noodles in our lives.
AMANDA: Oh, yeah. Tom Yum, Julia.
JULIA: Ooh.
AMANDA: I would choose that for you.
JULIA: Hell yeah.
AMANDA: I mean, this sounds like instant noodle with flavor not for just, like, American white people, which is good.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: All right, move on.
JULIA: So not only were they eating that instant noodle camp food, they were also playing with a huge kit of glow sticks they had bought from the local shop.
AMANDA: I did see a dog, Julia, with a little glow stick on his collar as he went for a walk with his owner yesterday, and a— a little tear did— did roll down my— my cheek.
JULIA: That is so cute. I love that. "So to set the scene, we are sitting in a big sports oval grassy area. To my right about 15 meters off is a playground and some park benches, and in that direction but only two feet away are Mary and River. And to my back left is a fence that blocks off the caravan park grounds from the local rich people's three-storey apartments. And in front of me is Summer and past her, the road that leads parallel to us through the caravan park."
AMANDA: Okay.
JULIA: Alright, setting the scene. We're in kind of like a— I would imagine like a soccer field or a rugby field if you're in Australia.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: That kind of vibe. Alright.
AMANDA: Just for myself and the listeners, we have Zephyr in the middle because this is from her perspective. To the right, we got Mary and River. Beyond them, a playground. To the back in the left, a little fence around the parking lot and the— the apartments. And then in front of us, in front of Zephyr, is Summer and beyond her, a road.
JULIA: So with the scene set, we start with the spookiness. Summer has looped three glow sticks together with those little connector things and made a hoop that we're throwing around. Very fun, very teenage. We love it.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "With one less than coordinated throw, Summer, aiming to toss it straight up, instead tosses it behind her head." We've all been there. "We laughed at her and she stands to go pick it up. Instant adrenaline."
AMANDA: Whoa!
JULIA: "The second she stands up, all four of us get the sudden and intense feeling of being watched. Looking at each other to confirm for sanity, I stand up immediately as Summer, glow stick hoop forgotten, turns back to us. 'Did you guys feel that?' Mary asks. 'Get up,' I say. River has already stood up at this point and Mary starts shoving all of our stuff into her bag. 'What the fuck?' River says as we stand back-to-back, spinning in circles, trying to tell which way we are being watched from. Summer steps out looking into the darkness of the trees away off as River and I stand beside Mary while she grabs our stuff." Shoutout to Mary to make sure like all your stuff is still, like, with you guys and you guys watching her back. Like, very smart, good survival instincts. We love to see it.
AMANDA: Yeah, I think I'm the Mary in the situation and Julia is definitely the River or Zephyr, just looking around, making sure that nothing's gonna, you know, hit my target as I do that.
JULIA: Yes. So Zephyr says, "I pay special attention to the apartments, immediately thinking that someone might be on the balcony looking down at us. There's no one there, and all of the curtains are drawn. It doesn't feel like it's coming from that way either. Whatever is watching us is not watching us from there. Mary has picked up our stuff and finally disconnected the speaker that was playing unsuitable chill, soft rock music as we all freaked out." Nothing better than music that does not fit the vibe in a situation like this.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: We love it. Especially in, like, horror movies and stuff like— like a discordant, like, soft rock song while terrible things are happening. Always one of my favorite things.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "So Mary stands and Summer leads us to the road and the streetlights about 10 meters away. I catch her by the elbow and pull her into our huddle, 'There's safety in numbers and whatever is watching us doesn't feel friendly.'"
AMANDA: Julia, these— these kids are doing it right.
JULIA: No notes.
AMANDA: I know you said it already. I want to just underline that. They are protecting each other, get into the light, get into safety, not staying in this big, open field. I think that's a really good instinct.
JULIA: Yeah, a lot of times in situations like this, in stories like this, I'm very critical of what is being done, where like, "Yeah, it seemed really spooky, so I decided, 'Hey, let me go check the— the line of the woods that are right next door.'"
AMANDA: "Yeah. Let me touch the curse tree. That sounds like a great idea."
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Yeah, no. These kids know what's up. Alright. "So we speed walk to the lights and then to the road, passing the bins as we go." That means garbage cans, right?
AMANDA: It does.
JULIA: Alright, cool. "I suddenly feel nauseous, a copper taste in my mouth." That's the adrenaline.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: "I figure it must be anxiety until I look at River who is practically gagging at the smell of something. He's always had a soft stomach. And then Mary who's waving a hand in front of her face as if to waft away a stench. Summer's nose is wrinkled, too. I can't smell whatever they can, but I feel sick to my stomach and my mouth floods with saliva in a way I am familiar with from my many childhood bouts of car sickness."
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "I grab River and pull him to the road, Summer nudging Mary along. We move to the right instinctively towards mine and River's camp where our parents will be talking and drinking around the fire. We move right, and as soon as we get behind the treeline and behind a tent, the adrenaline, nausea, and fear shed like a second skin."
AMANDA: Whoa.
JULIA: "We spend our moment of brief respite, sharing hushed expletives." Such teenage vibes. We love it.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "We continue on hoping whoever, whatever was watching us has gone. The moment we step out from our tree intent double layer of protection, the adrenaline and feeling of being watched hit us again. And we freak, becoming a hurried amorphous blob of hysteria. We press on, pausing briefly each time the line of sight is blocked from the oval and that feeling of relative safety washes over us."
AMANDA: Man, so this is like— yeah, it's definitively coming from the area where they were.
JULIA: Yeah, because like anytime that they can't see the oval anymore, they feel relatively safe.
AMANDA: Also don't love it, it's an oval. Something—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: —about a square reads a lot less spooky to me, I think.
JULIA: Yeah. Or just like a reg— well, actually, I think the closer you get to circle, the scarier the thing is. Is that a safe bet?
AMANDA: I think so, Julia, but then you surpass it and get to triangle, which is the scariest shape.
JULIA: That is also true. That is also true, because it's just so strong, Amanda. It's the strongest natural shape.
AMANDA: It's the strongest natural shape. You can't break it.
JULIA: So Zephyr continues, "I don't know why we didn't stop at our parents' camp, or how they didn't notice us panic walk past them. I think because of the way our tents were set up, we were not blocked from sight of whatever was watching us at our campsite, so we hurried past and be lined for the toilet block. This particular bathroom block features a curved external wall and we sprinted the last few steps to break the line of sight and hide. Mary pushes past me and hurdles into the bathroom on this side of the toilets, a smaller women's restroom where she pushes past and holds open the door for the rest of us. Safe, finally refuge in this tiny, dingy bathroom. We are so relieved we do not think to be glad no one is in the bathroom where us three terrified girls flew in accompanied by a six-foot-tall boy who looks about ready to leap into Mary's arms, a la Scooby-Doo and Shaggy." Extremely funny image.
AMANDA: Extremely funny image. Now normally, Julia, we may be a touch critical of people kind of barricading themselves, you know, in like a smaller area with less exit options. But in this case, I think this is smart. I think that's a— a strong structure. This is a tornado-flood-hurricane situation. I feel like they're doing what's right. And I like that there are some, you know, potential weapons in there, if— if we got to get there.
JULIA: Yeah, and it also is the main reason they are fleeing is because they want to break the sight line. So this curved wall that breaks off the bathroom from, like—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: —being seen past it is, like, very important, I guess, to making sure this thing is no longer watching them.
AMANDA: Right. It's like putting the mirror up to the Gorgon like it, you know, freezes them. JULIA: Exactly. So Zephyr continues, "We take the time here to make a game plan after we all talk over the top of each other about what just happened, of course. Mary mentions the smell, and when I asked what it smelled like, they look at me like I'm crazy. As if from an outside perspective, we do not all look mad in an Alice in Wonderland kind of way. They tell me it smelled like rotten meat. Summer, the oldest and the one trying to take control of the situation, posits the fact that we were near the bins," which sure, you know, rotting smells of your garbage, very common thing. New Yorkers know what it is. So it's probably that, hopefully, fingers crossed.
AMANDA: Hopefully.
JULIA: "I counter with the fact that a few hours ago, I had put a wrapper in the bins and they had just been emptied. Also, the fact that we had walked past on the way to the oval and that there had been no smell at all. We take the time to collect ourselves and figure out what to do next. There is nothing to do, we decide, but to get us all back to our campsite, call it a night, and hope none of us get possessed while we're sleeping or wakes up and sees someone's head twisting 360 exorcist style."
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Yup. Yeah, very true. "Luckily, it turns out our group can be split into two easily."
AMANDA: Buddy system. Love it.
JULIA: Buddy system is good. I'm never a fan of splitting the party—
AMANDA: That's true.
JULIA: —in— in horror movie situations in general. But as long as you guys have buddy systems, it should be okay.
AMANDA: And they are with their families too, right? So nobody is, like, alone and like two duos wandering through the woods. "Oh, we'll meet up later." Meanwhile, someone gets their, you know, throat cut by Jason or whatever.
JULIA: Yes. Luckily, Zephyr clarifies this, "Summer is spending the extra night in Mary's family bus, and River and I camp literally right next to each other in the spots nearest to the toilet blocks. So that was perfect. No one has to walk back alone."
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: As we just said, perfect. One teensy-weensy problem, Mary's bus is on the other side of the road from the oval, a.k.a. where we just panic fled from."
AMANDA: Um—
JULIA: "That's right. We have to go back to the beginning." That's not good. Just— everyone just like chill at Zephyr and River's place, then.
AMANDA: Yeah. Call Mary's parents. Mary's camping with us tonight.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Wave across the oval. Bye-bye.
JULIA: Sorry. Bye-bye.
AMANDA: Bye.
JULIA: Zephyr says, "In the words of an anthropomorphic tiger named Tony, who I've only read about in legend, "Great." Oh, Australians.
AMANDA: I never thought about it quite that way, but all of the pop culture references that we dig into really are just modern legends of their own, you know?
JULIA: They truly are. They truly are. "So off we go. We pop our heads out of the bathroom mystery gang style, one on top of the other." That's hyperbole. "And huddle up again to begin our trek back to the scene of the crime, or close enough, at least. Our trek back is much the same as our last, so I'll spare you the details. Just know that it sucks."
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "So we arrive at the opening for the oval near the bins. I note the distinct lack of smell and nausea. We hurry to the bus and Mary opens the door. Summer is still in her place behind her, and Summer is locked in place, staring at something. We all follow her gaze, but I see nothing. But I hear River and Mary gasp, and the intensity of adrenaline and fear hits me 10 times stronger than before and more focused almost. As if I can feel whatever they can see. My body knows where this specter is, even if my eyes do not. Mary and River watch it, eyes darting. I hear Summer muttering something indistinct and force myself to focus on it. It sounds like gibberish at first, but then I hear it as soon as we're in the bus, 'Run.'"
AMANDA: Whoa.
JULIA: "She says the first part of this so quickly all the words run together, but the run comes through as clear as anything. Summer bolts, rips her eyes away, and grabs Mary, pulling her into the bus. I grab River and pull him, and we sprint the whole way back to our camp. When we get there, we try to explain what happened, but neither of us can find the words. I am shaking so much that my mom pulls me into her lap and I burst into tears, and River is on the verge of crying as well. The next morning, I asked them what they saw, and they described it as humanoid and weathered, pulling a dead leg behind it."
AMANDA: Okay, that's bad.
JULIA: That's pretty.
AMANDA: That's bad.
JULIA: That's pretty bad. "Later on, I make a spur of the moment decision to walk to the information desk and ask if anyone ever got run over there. The front desk lady is as confused as you would imagine, but tells us, "No." However, later research says that there was a tourist who got run over near there by a van. Something that shot fear into our hearts based on the experience of the previous night. But alas, that will have to be saved for a prequel story, sneak peek, ghost man with a van. Honestly, the worst part was realizing that my mom and I were staying an extra, extra night without all of the others."
AMANDA: Oh man.
JULIA: "I spent the entire day in the tent and can happily report no spookiness happened that night. Happy haunting." Zephyr, that is great, and I do want to hear the prequel story about the ghost man with a van. I do now. I need the context.
AMANDA: I know. I feel kind of badly for your mom that she's like, "Ah, yeah, like me and Zephyr will have a little, you know, like mom-kid moment." No, no, no.
JULIA: And then you were like, "I'm not leaving this tent ever."
AMANDA: Yeah. Let's— let's read together in this tent.
JULIA: And never go outside, nor near that circle, or by the road ever again.
AMANDA: Oh, man. Well, the kids are alright, Julia.
JULIA: The kids are alright.
AMANDA: These teens did great. And Zephyr, as a slightly more grown-up teen, I trust your judgment and I am very eager to hear that prequel story, and any other stories that you and your friends got into. But love the instincts, love sticking together, love that you did a little scientific experimentation. And I love that you explored mundane explanations, such as— I mean, there were the bins, but then thought it through, like "Hmm, it wouldn't have been no smell as we passed it and then extreme smell coming back the other way." You know, because that's how smell works.
JULIA: It's also wild that— and Zephyr, she talked about the kind of, like, ghost blindness but the fact that she couldn't smell any of the smells that her friends were smelling. She couldn't see the spirit herself.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: That's rough. Like, to be the one person out of the loop in that situation, where it's like you can't see the thing, you can't smell the thing, but you can feel the fear and the adrenaline. That's scary. That's scarier in my opinion.
AMANDA: Yeah. That's— that's serious business, but gosh, I'm glad that you wrote in.
JULIA: Yes, I am so glad, and I want to hear that prequel story real bad.
AMANDA: Well, Julia, after all that excitement, I do think I'm gonna need a bit of a refill. How do you feel about that?
JULIA: Let's go for it.
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AMANDA: Hey, everybody, Amanda here. Welcome to the mid-roll. We would like to begin by thanking all the people who figured out, which we didn't know, that you could now follow us for free on Patreon. So if that's the thing that you want to do, if you want to support us later, or when you get some money, or when you're able to, and you want to follow the page for free in the meantime, that's now a thing you're allowed to do. Go on over to patreon.com/spiritspodcast to follow. Thank you always to not our followers but our friends, supporting producer-level patrons, Uhleeseeuh, Anne, Ginger Spurs Boi, Hannah, Jack Marie, Jane, Kneazlekins, Lily, Matthew, Nathan, Phil Fresh, Rikoelike, Captain Jonathan MAL-uh-kye Cosmos, Sarah and Scott. And our legend-level legends Arianna, Audra, Bex, Morgan H., Sarah, and Bea Me Up Scotty. Again, that's patreon.com/spiritspodcast to join for things like additional monthly bonus hometown urban legends. If you love these episodes, and you're like, "Dang, I have to wait another few weeks." Great news, you can listen to like dozens and dozens of ones we've done in the past, and get a brand-new one every single month if you join at Patreon. You can also get ad-free episodes, downloadable recipe cards, a video advice podcast that Julia and I published once a month. We just published the last one. It's all about Halloween advice, very good stuff. All of that, patreon.com/spiritspodcast. This week, I'm going to recommend a book and it's not my usual, you guys may know that I love heists and I love finance. I'm a geek about money. I worked in finance as you know before being a podcaster full-time. And even I, a person who worked in finance, who was literally paid to understand like economics and the market, haven't really understood crypto. It is— it is a cryptid for me, and it is something that I— I think is very stupid. And now, the rest of the world is beginning to kind of catch on. And so I have loved this nonfiction book that I had been reading recently from the library called Number Go Up by Zeke Faux. Number one, Zeke Faux, most incredible name I have ever seen. If I run into Zeke in Brooklyn at some point, I'm gonna say, "Zeke, that's the most incredible name I've ever heard." Secondly, he does a really, really good job of not getting bogged down in the technical details, but also being like, hey, this is essentially an industry filled with scammers that has impacts on real people as grifters get rich. And if you find like nonfiction books about scams or corporate disasters interesting, like me, if your brain is strange in the same way, you got to check out Number Go Up by Zeke Faux. A link to that book where you can get it via bookshop.org, which gives us a little bit of an affiliate kickback, but also supports independent bookstores across the US. And all of the books that Julia and I have ever recommended and all our guests have ever written, it's a lot of them. Go to spiritspodcast.com/books. This week in Multitude, it is a very, very special week. It is the kind of week that only comes around a couple times a year, because it is new podcast launch week. We have a brand-new podcast sibling, it's Big Game Hunger!, where previous guests from Spirits, Jenna Stoeber, who talked to us all about creepy pastas and internet legends. Julia and I totally fangirled when we talked to her, but now, she is our friend and our colleague because she has a brand-new show with Multitude. It is called Big Game Hunger! And it's a weekly comedy show where Jenna and friends craft the next big video game in every episode. They start with a randomly generated genre concept and vibe. And then Jenna and her guests talk about how they can take these ideas to some kind of huge video game franchise that they can one day pitch to a shadowy board of investors. Listen, Jenna is incredible and putting things into the slot machine of her brain just ends with absolute hilarity. By the end of each episode, they will have honed an IP so irresistible, you'd be willing to risk 20 bucks for it on Steam. So get ready to laugh about games you love, learned about game trends, because they talk about, like, different genres, why tropes or tropes, why different things are happening in video gaming, and yearn for titles that will surely never make their release date. Plus, I have it on good authority that some sick merch is in the office. So check it out, Big Game Hunger! New episodes come out every single Monday, go to biggamehunger.com or look up Big Game Hunger! in your podcast app. The show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Now, if there has ever been a time where you know what you should do, what's good for you, what you know what help you out, but you just can't make yourself do it, A, that thing is very human. I know I experienced that all the time, so you're in good company. But also, it can be really frustrating to feel like you're getting in your own way. Like, okay, I know what I need to do, that is hard. Now, how can I make myself do it? That's something that I honestly felt really ashamed of for a long time. It felt like some kind of personal failing. Until I started talking about it in therapy where I could say to my therapist, "Hey, I know that I— I want to do these things and yet I can't. And that makes me feel ashamed." And instead of just like sitting like a squirrel with my shame acorn that I hide deep in the ground and then, like, turn and touch every so often to make sure it's there, I get to, like, do something about it, and then come up with some help with the help of a trained professional as to how I can move past it. And if you're thinking of starting therapy, and you need a solution that is online, convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule, BetterHelp is a really good option to check out. All you got to do is fill out a brief questionnaire and get matched with a licensed therapist. And best of all, you can switch therapists at any time for no additional charge. I think my therapist right now is the first therapist I've ever felt, like actually understands what I need, and like challenges me, and asks me for things, and like gives me homework, which I really enjoy. And this is like the fifth one I've seen, so it takes time sometimes. So make your brain your friend with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com/spirits today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P, .com/spirits. Next, we are sponsored by Embrace Pet Insurance. Now, this is a new sponsor to the show, so they have a very special welcome. But also as an aspiring dog parent and very overbearing dog, and I could not be more excited to have them on the show. My sister Bailey has a dog named Koda who is a Pitbull mix that she rescued in Hawaii where she lives. He's five years old, he's the light of my life. Every single day, I say to her, "Bailey, I hope you're good, but more importantly, how's Koda?" And that is just how me, and my dad, and my grandma, and all my other siblings talk to her. So Koda is the absolute light of my life, I would do anything for him. And he has good medical insurance, because a couple of times Bailey has had to make use of it. And I'm really grateful that whenever something is wrong, she can get him the care that she needs because she has pet insurance and knows that it's not going to be like a wild out-of-pocket expense every time something is wrong. A couple things I really appreciate about Embrace in particular. Number one, with Embrace Pet Insurance, you can visit any vet or emergency clinic. I know very often when you're in that situation, you want to go to the closest one as soon as possible and needing to, like, check an app, or call someone, or figure out like which ones you're allowed to go to is a challenge that you don't want to deal with in that moment. And second, if you have multiple pets to ensure, you are eligible for a 10% multi-pet discount, which hey, that's helpful. They also have a 24/7 helpline and optional wellness rewards program so that you can do preventative care, and never hopefully need to use the insurance in the first place. I know for Bailey and hopefully for me one day, if and when I get to adopt a dog, it'll be really great to have that peace of mind knowing that I have insurance if I need it. And if, you know, something terrible happens and I have to kind of choose between what my pet needs and my budget, nobody wants to be in that situation. And so insurance is an absolute must have to help me quell some of that anxiety. So don't wait for the unexpected to happen, join the massive community of pet owners who trust Embrace Pet Insurance to protect their pet. Head to embracepetinsurance.com/spirits and sign up for pet insurance today. Make sure you go to embracepetinsurance.com/spirits or else they won't know that you came from us. That's embracepetinsurance.com/spirits. And finally, this episode is sponsored by Wild Grain. I love Wild Grain. I love walking into Julia's house and knowing that she's just popped a Wild Grain out of the oven. I love looking at my freezer and knowing there are things from Wild Grain in it. They are, of course, the first ever bake-from-frozen subscription box for sourdough breads, fresh pastas, and artisanal pastries. Oh, God. They're so good. My favorite part of Wild Grain is the croissants. I know I'm kind of basic, but like, I'm a croissant connoisseur, okay? I've had like every croissant in my neighborhood. I've had most of the croissants in New York City. I know my favorites. And I gotta tell you, a Wild Grain croissant fresh out of the oven, it's the best. There is nothing like it. I wouldn't hype this up if it wasn't true, guys. It's so good. The baking process is really easy, and having some stuff in my freezer that I know is like 20 or 30 minutes away from being done at any given time is amazing when I have friends over or unexpected company, or like happened recently, my mother-in-law's flight got delayed and we had breakfast when I was not planning on making breakfast. And now, you can fully customize your Wild Grain box, so you can get any combination of breads, pastas, and pastries that you like. If you want a box that's all bread, all pasta, all pastries, whatever, you can have it. Plus, for a limited time, you can get $30 off the first box, plus free croissants in every box when you go to wildgrain.com/spirits to start your subscription. You heard me, free croissants in every box and $30 off your first box when you go to wildgrain.com/spirits. That's wildgrain.com/spirits, or you can use promo code Spirits at checkout. And now, let's get back to the show.
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JULIA: Amanda, we are back, and I have an abundance, an abundance of pumpkin beer that we're still going through at this point in the month. And I feel like I am good with pumpkin beer, like, honestly until like early December. I think, like, people are like, "Ah, yeah, you know, September, October, that's pumpkin beer season. We can, you know— and that's it." But like I kind of like the flavor of, like, the pumpkin spice in beer, like up until around Christmas time, around the holidays and stuff like that. So I am going to keep on recommending the one that I have in stock, which is the Southern Tier Pumking, my favorite. It's like the booziest, the best in my opinion. It's like— I feel like it was the pumpkin beer that popularized pumpkin beer.
AMANDA: I think it was.
JULIA: And, Amanda, I just found out just now, and I'm gonna buy this for Jake before the season is over, Southern Tier put out a Pumking Whiskey.
AMANDA: Whoa.
JULIA: So a pumpkin beer-flavored whiskey. That is incredible sounding, incredible looking. I'm really, really excited to find this in the store somewhere and get it for Jake, because he's gonna flip his shit. Imagine the cocktails you can make with, like, a pumpkin spice whiskey. That would be so good, so good.
AMANDA: Yeah, it's like shaken up with little cream or coconut cream.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Oh. So good.
JULIA: Oh, my gosh. Yeah, like, even like something like a kalua— or imagine, Amanda, doing like a Espresso Martini with like the—
AMANDA: Ooh.
JULIA: —Mr. Black Coffee liqueur—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —and some of this— like a pumpkin spice Espresso Martini would be amazing.
AMANDA: Alright, put it on the menu for the next time we're at your house.
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: We will bring the apple cider doughnuts.
JULIA: I'll allow it.
AMANDA: You bring the drinks. That sounds—
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: —perfect.
JULIA: That sounds really good. What have you been enjoying lately, Amanda?
AMANDA: I recently went to the taproom for Talea, a locally own brewery here in New York City, specifically in Greenpoint. And I ordered one of their Basically Pumpkin, their autumn ale, which they described as a light bodied ale brewed with pumpkin pie spice from McCormick, the spice company.
JULIA: Hell yeah.
AMANDA: So like the— the most classic of flavors. But the reason, Julia, is like, A, it's a perfectly delicious beer, but B, it comes with a cinnamon sugar rim. And something I just need to suggest and have been leaning into myself, sort of a general, like, life tip is if you show up to a bar, especially a brewery, which doesn't make like, let's say, margaritas with a traditional salt rim, and you see like a sugar or salt rim station set up behind the bar, just be like, "Whatever that is, that's what I want."
JULIA: Yes, Amanda. Perfect thinking.
AMANDA: Yup.
JULIA: I agree 100%.
AMANDA: Yup.
JULIA: A 100%. Like, honestly, I was talking to someone, I was at a— a baby shower, and they had the Montauk Pumpkin beer—
AMANDA: Nice.
JULIA: —in cans.
AMANDA: Very solid choice.
JULIA: Very solid choice. And I was like, "Oh, this is really good." And then my friend turned to me, she's like, "I like pumpkin beers. I think 90% of the reason I get pumpkin beers, like, at a brewery ore at a bar is for the sugar rim." And I'm like—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: —"Chelsea, you're not wrong and I— I appreciate your honesty in that." She's like, "It's really good." I'm like, "It is really good." In September, it kind of sucks, especially If you're at, like, an outdoor venue, because it's, like, definitely yellow Jack season.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: But now, that the weather is colder and the bugs are not out as much, outdoor sugar rim, mwa, chef's kiss.
AMANDA: And listen, Julia, it's a perfect time of year for our conspirators to take advantage of the fact that here a bunch of retailers are going to be transitioning almost immediately, right, once Halloween is over, into the sort of like Christmas takeover. And so stock up, use those sales, do what you did, and get that essentially palette of pumpkin beer at very, very cheap prices—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —as they turn over to, like, winter warmer beers, which to me, never as good.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Give me a pumpkin beer with my laktes at Hanukkah. Give it to me with my Thanksgiving meal. That is what I want to be drinking all winter long. So take advantage, and stock up on that stuff now.
JULIA: Yes. And also, just remember on November 1st, all the Halloween stuff goes on sale.
AMANDA: Oh, yeah.
JULIA: And a lot of Halloween stuff, at least in my household, is all-year round stuff. Not just, "oh, we put it out for September and October." No, no, no. I have a really cool palmistry hand that I got from Michael's last year. That is still like just hanging out on one of my shelves.
AMANDA: Yup.
JULIA: I got some really cool— from Spirit Halloween last year, really cool, like, terrariums that are like kind of spooky celestial vibes. Like, get the stuff for cheap if your aesthetic is a little bit spooky. That's all I'm saying.
AMANDA: Yeah. Including at, like, a drugstore like— you know I'm here in the city, I'm not near many of those stores, but like, go to a drugstore and they'll have cute like seasonal decor on sale on November 1st, I promise.
JULIA: Yes. 100%. 100%.
AMANDA: That is a Wednesday this year, Julia, so perhaps, perhaps I can meet you after work and we can do a little cruise.
JULIA: Ooh. I'm down for it. We could do Target, we could do the Spirit Halloween.
AMANDA: I was gonna say, I hit that Target near your house when I was watering your plants.
JULIA: Uh-hmm. It's a nice target.
AMANDA: It's a nice target. Anyway, back to the urban legend, shall we?
JULIA: Back to the urban legends.
AMANDA: Alright. I was really sort of warmed in my heart by this homeschool kid camp, and so I'm going to bring you a story from Blaine, he/him, called Summer Camp Nighttime Noises.
JULIA: Ooh, okay. Alright.
AMANDA: Blaine starts with, "Hey, Spirits team, after marathoning your back catalogue for the last six months, I think I'm finally ready to submit my own experience."
JULIA: Ooh, okay.
AMANDA: "Now, while I'm very much a skeptic, and can usually figure out what the root of a situation is, that doesn't stop things from being very creepy in the moment. And this is a story of one of those times."
JULIA: Uh-oh. Uh-oh.
AMANDA: "In the summer of '95, I attended a student leadership camp in Colorado."
JULIA: Millennials.
AMANDA: Blaine, thank you for being a grown man listening to our podcast. Much appreciated.
JULIA: Not that we— listen, I said it before, we love when the Gen Z write in, too.
AMANDA: We love the kids.
JULIA: We love the kids.
AMANDA: But Julia, I know that a person who was a person in 1995 is also listening to our podcast.
JULIA: Shoutout.
AMANDA: Right?
JULIA: Shoutout.
AMANDA: We're— we're bridging the gap here. Come on.
JULIA: Bringing that Gen Z and Gen X together to bond over millennials talking about their stories.
AMANDA: Exactly. Alright. "Student Leadership summer camp in Colorado, the first day was a blur and exhausting as many of us, myself included, had to fly in from different regions of the country, including other countries from around the world."
JULIA: Whoa.
AMANDA: "In fact, someone flew in from Japan to Colorado to attend this camp, which I never considered relevant to the story until I saw the excellent horror movies out of Japan many years later."
JULIA: Japan does have a great kind of history of horror movies. And if you haven't, like, watched like the original Ring in Japanese or the original Grudge, or— there's a lot of like good ones that have subtitles that you can find online nowadays. Check those out. They're like a lot of the American horror from, like, the 2000s comes from like '80s and '90s Japanese horror.
AMANDA: Trendsetting.
JULIA: Trendsetters.
AMANDA: "Like many summer camps, this one was set up with bunk beds."
JULIA: Of course.
AMANDA: "Also like many camps, there was a mix of how fast people could settle in when lights out happened."
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: "Some kids zonked off right away. Others chatted, which I was fine with as it gave me clues as to who I might want to hang out with more the next day."
JULIA: Smart.
AMANDA: "And after what seemed like an hour or so, though I never checked my watch, of course, the chattering died down and I was on the verge of falling asleep. When suddenly, someone shouted at full volume, 'Holy shit, they're eating me alive.'"
JULIA: Now, Amanda—
AMANDA: Yup.
JULIA: —before we get into that—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Did you— what was, like, your first experience realizing that people talk in their sleep?
AMANDA: I think hearing people talk about hearing other people do it—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —because I— I didn't go to as many like, you know, camp sleepover type situations as other people.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: My siblings mostly snored in their sleep. So when we like bunk together, you know, at home or on vacations, it was just like— you know, I'd be annoyed if they coughed or something. So, I— I think it was just in, you know, middle and high school being like, "Oh, yeah, it's crazy. I talked in my sleep." And I'm like, "Okay." Like, it felt like the thing that people said to attract attention.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: I don't think I've ever heard someone do it.
JULIA: Really?
AMANDA: Yeah, still.
JULIA: I have only had two experiences of, like, hearing people talking in their sleep. One was when I shared a room with my college roommate, Carly, after we had to move out of the housing that we were in, because it kept getting broken into.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: And so they moved us into like a shared room, which we had never shared a room before, we had always had separate rooms, like in a suite of some kind. And so she would, like, stay up a little later than be on her computer or like doing a phone call with her sisters and stuff. And then I think that like conversation would follow through with her into her sleep.
AMANDA: Hmm.
JULIA: And so she would be, like, talking and I would be like, "Oh, yeah." And then she would respond to me, like, in her sleep. And I'd be like—
AMANDA: Damn, dude.
JULIA: "—Okay, that's cool." And she's like, "And then Fallon was like, "Uh—" and I'm like, "Oh, yeah, that's— that's rough. Alright." And then the other time was we were visiting Jake's mom down in Delaware and his aunt was also visiting her, and his aunt took sleeping pills—
AMANDA: Ah.
JULIA: —to get to sleep. And one of the side effects of those sleeping pills was she would, at full volume, just scream things—
AMANDA: Wow.
JULIA: —in the other room, and it was a lot of her being like, "Law and order." And I'm like, 'What's happening?"
AMANDA: Whoa!
JULIA: And I was like, "Oh, okay." And she's like, "We gotta bring them to justice." I'm like, "What's happening in there?"
AMANDA: Whoa. Oh, my.
JULIA: And that's through, like, a door—
AMANDA: That's loud.
JULIA: —like through a wall, separate bedrooms. And I'm like, "Okay, Susan. Calm down. Calm down, okay?"
AMANDA: Well, who— okay, so is Susan— does Susan love— does Susan love JL? Or is Susan trying to get justice for other causes?
JULIA: Susan is an Italian woman from Staten Island. That should answer your question.
AMANDA: Okay. Yup. No, that's enough. Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah. Yeah. But someone yelling, "Holy shit. They're eating me alive," I think that would disturb me a little bit more than Susan screaming, "Law and order."
AMANDA: Yeah, yup. "So mostly, my cabin reacted with stunned silence. A counselor tried to investigate what happened, but the three people nearest to where the shouting was coming from were either too groggy to have been a prankster or actually still asleep even after we turn the lights on."
JULIA: Wow.
AMANDA: "After giving up, the rest of the night pass without further incident.
JULIA: Okay. Fair enough. Fair enough. I mean, like, yeah, if you heard that, I feel like your brain, half-asleep, would not be able to register like who said that. You would just be like—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: "—I heard loud shouting and then eating me alive. And I was like, what's up?"
AMANDA: Yeah, and especially if we're all teens our first night in like a camp situation hopped up on adrenaline, I would also assume somebody is pranking. I think now in my— in my 30s, I understand that, you know, bodies and brains do weird shit. But as a teen, I'd be like, "Who did that?"
JULIA: Yeah. Especially in, like, new circumstances and stuff like that.
AMANDA: 100%. "The next night, I was really curious if this would happen again. But honestly, the day was so full of fun, I had forgotten and was pleasantly in my own head thinking about the memories I made that day at camp."
JULIA: Aw.
AMANDA: "When we reached the same point in the night about an hour after lights out. This time, we heard a shout of, 'Oh, God, no!' Followed by a really loud knock on the wall.
JULIA: Uh-oh. I don't know if that's worse or better than the, "Oh, God. They're eating me alive," part.
AMANDA: Okay. So we have, "Holy shit, they're eating me alive."
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: Compared to, "Oh, God, no." Followed by a really loud bang.
JULIA: I feel like, "Oh, God, no," could just be someone be like, "Huh," and then falling out of bed.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: That would be like the loud knock on the wood or, like, hitting their head or something like that. Like, we'll see. We'll see.
AMANDA: It's true— I'm trying to debate with myself here. I think that will creep me out more though, the, "Oh, God. No," with a knock, A, because a knock always takes the creepiness factor, you know, up to a 12.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: And B, especially because these are adolescent boys, I feel like the, "Holy shit, eating me alive," reads to me as more of a prank and, "Oh, God, no," sounds like a thing that you say because of a situation, you know?
JULIA: Because you're about to get eaten or murdered, yes.
AMANDA: Something bad is gonna happen to you.
JULIA: Yeah, yeah. I think just the physicality of the loud knock too like—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —adds more confirmation that something happened.
AMANDA: Yeah, it's a voice plus force, not just like a person.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: "This time, we investigated less. But more was made clear by morning."
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: Okay. "One camper woke with a large bruise on their forehead."
JULIA: Oh, okay.
AMANDA: Do you see where this is going?
JULIA: Yes, I see where this is going.
AMANDA: "They had made a deal with their bunkmate to switch bunks every night so they both got to enjoy the top bunk some of the time."
JULIA: Aw, that's kind of sweet. Boys are sharing.
AMANDA: Love this for them. "This person also had history of sitting up and yelling things while dreaming and then lying back down, never waking up throughout the entire process."
JULIA: Oh, boy, that's really funny.
AMANDA: They thought they were past this phase, but clearly not.
JULIA: I— I think that's something that you have to warn people in your cabin about beforehand, being like, "Hey, I think it's not a problem anymore, but—"
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: "—just in case, I do have a habit of screaming in the middle of the night."
AMANDA: I do have so much sympathy for this team though, who was probably like, "Yeah, yeah. Surely, it won't happen. If their parents are used to it, maybe nobody's mentioned it to them in months or years."
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: And then, you know, you go away and you want to make a good impression on all these cool kids from around the country in the world and—
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: —it's like, "Oh, yeah. Nope, that's— that's Bruce kid who yells in the middle of the night."
JULIA: That's the screamer.
AMANDA: Oh, tough. Alright. "The first night because they were on the top bunk, we did not hear the knock. But the second night on the bottom bunk, he did not have enough space to sit up fully and did hit their head on a beam."
JULIA: That means the bunk beds are too small. You should be able to fully sit up with a bunk bed, you know?
AMANDA: You should.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: And I mean, maybe— like if these are tall teen boys—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —I guess maybe not, but yeah, that— that is— that's too small.
JULIA: But, Amanda, as a tall person, like, I know, there's bunk beds up at your— your lake house place and stuff like that.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Those bunk beds are tall enough that if you sat up it wouldn't go "bomp."
AMANDA: They're just tall enough. Actually, if you sit up on the top bunk, you do hit the ceiling. But if you sit up on the bottom bunk, my head just kind of, like, just scrapes the bottom of the bottom bunk. So, you know, your mileage may vary.
JULIA: Yeah, I mean, just— I guess maybe this place was designed for younger kids. I mean, the bunk beds were smaller and not like, you know, teen-sized or adult-sized, so I can understand it, but I'm— at the same time, I'm like, "Just put— put the boys in bigger bunk beds."
That's all I'm saying.
AMANDA: I know, I know. Or un-bunk the beds, but, you know, square footage—
JULIA: Un-bunk those beds.
AMANDA: I— you know, it's hard, it's hard.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Alright. "Credit to the rest of my campers though, we supported him through what could have been an embarrassing experience."
JULIA: Aw.
AMANDA: This was leadership camp, Julia.
JULIA: These boys are very responsible and very mature.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: We love that for them.
AMANDA: "I don't think we ever told the other cabins we figured out what those screams were, and we did spend the week very amused that there are theories of the nighttime shouts."
JULIA: Great. Love it. I wonder if those other cabins could hear the nighttime shouts or it was just like a game of telephone through the camp.
AMANDA: I think either way that's very funny.
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: And Blaine includes with, "I have another story I may add some day about a friend who learned just what went bump in the night. In the meantime, stay creepy, stay cool. Blaine."
JULIA: Ooh. I— y'all can't just keep teasing us with these stories and then not send them in. Send in those followup stories. I want to hear sequels from everyone.
AMANDA: So good. Well, thank you Blaine or writing in.
JULIA: Thank you so much, Blaine. I— camp stories always really do it for me, and it's not just because, like, it makes me think of, you know, Camp Crystal Lake in Friday the 13th and stuff like that. Jake recently started rewatching the American Horror Story 1984, which is very much like the '80s summer camp haunted, there's a killer on the loose kind of situation.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: And this always kind of reminds me of that and I really like that as like kind of a cliche. So whenever we get camp stories, I'm always a little bit excited. Especially because, like, it's also enough distance for me because, you know, we went to a sleepaway camp once—
AMANDA: A long time ago, yeah.
JULIA: —you know? So it's not like a very relatable, but it's also like enough relatable that I'm like, "Yeah, spooky camp. Fuck yeah."
Amadna: It's just— it's so in the horror genre that it's appropriate all-year round, but it felt like a very fitting end to our spookiest of months to do a deep dive into this trope.
JULIA: I agree, Amanda. And next time you are at a summer camp that's got some spooky things being shouted into the night, stay creepy, y'all.
AMANDA: Stay cool.
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