Episode 206: Your Urban Legends XLI - Trapper Keeper Confusion
/We’re all over the place in this one, both in terms of content and geography. From Scandinavia to Alaska, we’re questioning your choices left and right when dealing with the supernatural. It’s a feisty one, folks!
Content Warning: This episode contains conversations about or mentions of possession, death, disturbed graves, science experimentation, zombies, violence against women, animal death/butchery, threat of animal attack, pandemic/Covid-19, feces, and curses.
Housekeeping
- Recommendation: This week, Julia recommends The City We Became by N.K. Jemisin. Check out our previous book recommendations, guests’ books, and more at spiritspodcast.com/books
- Merch: Check out our new digital merch, including the Cool Cryptid Compendium, at spiritspodcast.com/merch!
- Live Show: Our virtual live show is available for video on demand, so you can rewatch it whenever. Purchase your copy at spiritspodcast.com/live!
Sponsors
- Skillshare is an online learning community where you can learn—and teach—just about anything. Explore your creativity at Skillshare.com/spirits and the first 1,000 people to use our link will get a free trial of Skillshare Premium Membership. This week Amanda recommends “The Ten Principles of Painting In Daily Sketchbook Lessons” by Amarilys Henderson.
- Stitch Fix is an online personal styling service that finds and delivers clothes, shoes, and accessories to fit your body, budget, and lifestyle. Get started at stitchfix.com/spirits for 25% off when you keep your whole box!
- ThirdLove is on a mission to find a perfect bra for everyone. Get 10% off your first order at thirdlove.com/spirits.
Find Us Online
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Transcript
Amanda: Welcome to Spirits Podcast, a boozy dive into mythology, legends, and folklore. Every week, we pour a drink and learn about a new story from around the world. I'm Amanda Julia: And I'm Julia.
Amanda: And this is Episode 206: Your Urban Legends #41.
Julia: So many urban legends. Just – you know, we say that literally every episode. I feel kind of bad saying it, but it just blows me away that we have had the opportunity to read so many excellent stories sent in by our listeners.
Amanda: Yeah, Julia. And I sometimes search the inbox for keywords because I'm really feeling like doing theater ghost, you know, o creepy child or whatever.
Julia: Mhmm. Mhmm.
Amanda: Seeing the fact that people have been sending us these emails since 2017 is totally amazing. And, conspirators, we are so grateful that you take the time to write creepy ass emails to us.
Julia: It is absolutely wild and we appreciate every single one we read, everyone, even if we don't read them on the show.
Amanda: We absolutely do. It's the best part of my week. I creep myself at some times. So, I'd like to do it first thing in the morning before I get to my, my work emails for the day, which is great.
Julia: Yes.
Amanda: And do you know what else is great, Julia, to see first thing in the morning?
Julia: A new patron?
Amanda: A new patron notification email. Ki, thank you so much for joining us. Or Ki. It’s great name, whichever way you pronounce it. We really appreciate you joining. And we appreciate our supporting producer level patrons; Uhleeseeuh, Allison, Debra, Hannah, Jen, Jessica, Keegan, Kneazlekins, Landon, Liz, Megan Linger, Megan Moon, Phil Fresh, Polly, Riley, Sarah, Skyla, and The Campy Vamp.
Julia: Oh, gosh, all of these good, good names. It's just – it's like a – it's like seeing a bunch of friends on a Zoom chat just being like, “Oh, hey, you're all here. Great. Thank you for coming everyone.”
Amanda: Absolutely. And I just feel like, like, the, the ending. Like, this cadence is just – it's melodic. It’s beautiful.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: And thank you too to our melodic and beautiful legend level patrons; Audra, Chelsea, Drew, Frances, Jack Marie, Lada, Livie, Mark, Morgan, Necrofancy, Renegade, and Bea Me Up Scotty.
Julia: Hi. It is like a song. Siren song, you know, making sure that we get to make our art the way we want to make it.
Amanda: We so appreciate it. And, Julia, speaking of art, what have you been reading, watching, and listening to this week?
Julia: I am nearly finished with The City We Became by N.K. Jemisin. And, oh, my god, Amanda, Amanda, this book is so good.
Amanda: I know.
Julia: I've been kind of reading it in conjunction with rewatching Dimension 20s, The Unsleeping City.
Amanda: Ooh, good pairing.
Julia: And I just want to inhale all of the kind of magical New York energy because I miss going into the city really, really badly. I know it's for my own safety and the safety of others, but I just miss New York a whole, whole lot.
Amanda: I know. Huh. Well, that sounds like a perfect recommendation. And I wonder too, Julia, if you want to tell me a little bit about the magical inspiration that went into our newest merch item, the Cool Cryptid Compendium in Spirits X JTP crossover sneaker line event.
Julia: Extravaganza. Yes, I love it
Amanda: Extravaganza. Like, MoMa x Vans. It is Spirits X Join the Party.
Julia: I do have a pair of those MoMa x Vans and they're very, very cool. Anyway, so, the Cool Cryptid Compendium is basically a guide to incorporating certain spirits, and monsters, and deities into your tabletop RPG experience. It doesn't have to be for Dungeons and Dragons. It could be for whatever game you are playing. But, basically, I worked with DM Eric Silver to kind of figure out the coolest creatures from Spirits that we've talked about on the show, either passingly or that I found in my research and then figure out a way that you can bring them into your gaming experience. And it is a lot of fun. It was great to write. Eric came up with such cool mechanics for all of the creatures. And I'm just really, really proud of it. And it's got very cute little illustrations in it too that Zoe Polando Ryder, who also designed our National Park posters, also did the art for that. And it is great, and creepy, and cute. And I'm very, very proud of it.
Amanda: And I love that y'all made 20 creatures that don't have to be the big bad, you know.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: And whether you're reading this for – just for fun or to actually put into a game or maybe to use an inspiration in your writing, I love that it's not antagonistic. You know, so much of role playing games in general is like, “There's a monster. Slay it.” But, sometimes, you want to talk to the monster. Sometimes, you want to work with the monster. Sometimes, it's not a monster at all but a legend and lore that turned someone regular into this idea of a monster. So, I love that you guys are just kind of taking a different approach. And I think it's a way more fun one.
Julia: Yeah. There is one creature on there that we've talked about on the show that Eric was like, “What if you could befriend this and then it can – and, and then it becomes your companion?” I'm like, “Yes, excellent. I love that.” I’m not gonna spoil what creature it is. But it's an extremely good one. And I want to incorporate it into my next campaign.
Amanda: Absolutely. So, that, along with all of our physical merch, which is on sale for the whole month of November, is at spiritspodcast.com/merch. And, if you want to check out Join the Party merch, jointhepartypod.com/merch, there is so much to buy, and enjoy, and download. And you can get instant gratification. Get this right away because you get a download right as soon as you purchase.
Julia: Do it. You'll love it.
Amanda: All right. So, without further ado, everybody, thank you as always for writing us these creepy, awesome emails. And enjoy Spirits Podcast Episode 206: Your Urban Legends #41.
Intro Music
Julia: Do you have a house dog update for us, Eric?
Eric: I don't have much of a house dog update. House, still not haunted.
Julia: Hmm.
Eric: Dogs, still doing great.
Julia: Okay. I still don't believe that.
Eric: That is my update. They – everyone --
Amanda: No news is good news.
Julia: My problem is, Eric, that, last time you had a webcam --
Eric: Mhmm. Yes.
Julia: -- I saw your chair move on its own. And --
Eric: Now --
Julia: -- in the past couple episodes that we've recorded, I have not seen – you don't have a webcam right now.
Eric: Yes.
Julia: So, I haven't seen the room. So, I'm worried that maybe you're possessed and you're just not showing us your face because there's some sort of possession indicator there. Just a thought.
Eric: That could be it. It's more that the webcam I have is on my MacBook.
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: But all my audio equipment is on a desktop.
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: And it would just be a pain to set up both things at once so that I could definitively prove I am not currently being possessed by a haunt. But, you know – you know what is haunting? We – for Kelsey's birthday, we bought the game, Betrayal at House on the Hill.
Julia: Ohhh.
Eric: I believe it’s the title.
Amanda: Oh, yeah.
Julia: Such a fun games.
Eric: It’s – it's – we – I, I knew it was a popular game that you could play with. It, it seemed like a game that was cooperative, which means that we could play it together. But, also, it requires at least three players, but you can take, like, multiple players and, like, work it that way. But, halfway through the game, someone becomes the Betrayer.
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: It's very fun. And then, like, the other person just starts controlling all the other characters. So, that has been somewhat spooky in our house because of that. But, other than that, no, no abnormal spookiness happening.
Julia: What I really like about that game, too is there are so many different, like, betrayal choices.
Eric: Mhmm.
Julia: So, you can play that game a million times and just have a different outcome every time. It's a lot of – a lot of fun.
Eric: Yeah, it's been very good.
Julia: Yeah.
Eric: I've got a story about a trapper ghost or how to stop a haunting.
Julia: Okay.
Eric: So, like, if you get into this haunting situation – let's say you're – you are in real life up on Haunted Hill or whatever it’s called.
Julia: Sure.
Eric: And you – and you've gone up there with some of your friends and also a 11-year-old boy who's always with the game.
Julia: Always.
Eric: Let's say that happens and someone betrays you. Here's how you could stop a haunting. So, here's some practical advice, potentially.
Amanda: Love that.
Julia: When you said a trapper ghost, I was like the ghost of a Trapper Keeper? Is the ghost held in Trapper Keeper?
Eric: I mean it might be. It, it – you don't know. You don't know.
Julia: I feel like my generation missed the Trapper Keeper. Do you remember Trapper Keepers, Amanda?
Amanda: No, I'm – I'm lost. What is that?
Julia: I feel like it was an older 90s kid thing.
Eric: Let, let me tell you – tell you the Trapper Keeper
Julia: Well, thank you old man, Eric.
Amanda: I thought we were going into, like, Tailypo lore.
Eric: Oh, no. No. Trapper Keepers are – they’re binders that had, like, a cool graphic. They also had like a – like a fold over so you can have like a little Velcro thing. So, like – but it had, like, pockets or something. It was a nicer binder, essentially, by the company, Keeper, which I think makes like notebooks and binders to this day. But they release a line, like, specifically for kids called Trapper Keepers. And, like, I had a Sonic the Hedgehog 2 Trapper Keeper.
Julia: Oh, hell yeah.
Eric: Which is very cool which I use all the way through college because, fuck yeah, it was dope.
Amanda: I do really miss binder optimizations and, like, back-to-school shopping and supply lists and all of that. I, I remember finding like rubber edged binders that were really nice because they were grippy on the table that I used in, in high school. And, ahhh, I missed them.
Julia: Nice. They still sell Trapper Keepers. I'm looking online right now and Pottery Barn Kids and Teens have Trapper Keepers for sale.
Eric: Yeah, there's no way they're as radical as they were back in the 90s though.
Julia: They look pretty. There's, like, a very 90s style pattern here. It's like pink, purple marble recycled Trapper Keeper or something like that. It’s very cute.
Eric: Nothing is as radical as the 90s.
Julia: Okay.
Eric: The radicalness has never reached --
Julia: Lisa Frank levels of radical.
Eric: Except for – except for a leftists Twitter. The radicalness of the 90s has never been reached. Anyways, let's – let's read the story.
Julia: Yes, go ahead.
Eric: Hi, Spirits team. This has not happened to me directly, but it happened to my dad and his family. I have full permission to submit the story and he actually helped me write it. My dad grew up in an isolated mill town on the coast of British Columbia, Canada.
Julia: Huh.
Eric: It was the 90s. So, he had a cool Trapper Keeper.
Julia: Oh, hell yeah.
Eric: Nope. That’s all. That’s all folks.
Amanda: I see the relevance now. Thank you very much.
Eric: His parents bought two plots of land about 20 minutes outside of the town proper in the late 50s, 1950s to be clear.
Julia: Hmm.
Eric: One to build their house on and the other was used as a woodlot. My grandparents and their five kids built their own house, workshop, out house. It was the 50s after al. And it was – was it like the, the 1950s?
Julia: It has to be.
Eric: Surely. Surely, you had indoor plumbing. Oh, no. Maybe you're – you're out in the middle of nowhere British Columbia, I guess.
Julia: We've watched a lot – I feel like, between Amanda and I, we, we have watched a lot of, like, Alaskan real estate shows.
Amanda: Yes.
Eric: Mhmm.
Julia: So, a lot of times, those places don't have indoor plumbing. Sometimes, you just have an outhouse, you know.
Amanda: It's true. I'm also reading a mystery series right now set in the Shetland Islands, which is like the very, very north of Scotland.
Julia: Yes.
Amanda: And it is really giving me a powerful yearning to go back to Scotland and Ireland and just, like, bum around in some pubs, and, ideally, solve a murder.
Julia: Nice. On a Shetland pony, obviously.
Amanda: They haven't mentioned ponies at all. They haven't mentioned what is their island living though.
Julia: What is wrong with them?
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: Fair.
Eric: Once the house was built, strange things started happening, but only downstairs. Never upstairs. Things would fall off the mantle. Like, a two by four would fall over for no reason. Items on the coffee table would fall off in a very specific pattern, always east to west and at the speed of someone walking through the house.
Julia: That's weirdly specific.
Amanda: Ooh.
Eric: As if someone was just walking through just knocking stuff off kind of on a – on a loop, always the same direction.
Amanda: Unless – like, if this was one room, I would say maybe the floor was pitched in that direction.
Eric: Mhmm.
Amanda: But throughout an entire house is pretty impressive.
Eric: Yeah.
Julia: Though you can have an entire house pitched like that. Like, I remember when my parents had --
Amanda: Yeah, but, like, every table, their surface. You know what I mean? Like that --
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: -- that gets a little bit more – more of, like, that would be more remarkable if that was true.
Julia: That’s fair.
Eric: My grandmother swore up and down that there was a ghost in the house, but no one really listened to her. Because how could there be a ghost in a house you built yourself?
Julia: Respect your elders. Listen to them.
Amanda: You got the new ghost – that fresh ghost.
Eric: This kept happening once a month for a couple years until The Incident.
Julia: Oh, no.
Amanda: Yay. We love an incident.
Eric: My dad's bedroom was downstairs at this point next to the bathroom. They eventually got indoor plumbing. Well, there you go.
Julia: There you go.
Eric: One night, he woke up and there was a figure standing at the end of his bed.
Julia: Uh, umm.
Eric: He still wasn't sure if it was male or female, but probably male based off what happened later.
Julia: Uh, umm.
Eric: The figure did not say anything but walk through my dad's bed and through the wall behind it. Then, one day, many years later, a person purchased a lot of undeveloped land about a fourth of a mile down the road to build a house.
Julia: Oh, no. Oh, no. They’re gonna find the body.
Eric: While clearing the land, they found an unmarked grave.
Julia: There it is.
Eric: He was very confused because there hadn't been many Europeans in this area before the establish of the mill back in the early 1900s. And the indigenous people in the area did not bury their dead. After a police investigation and an archeological survey – I nailed archaeological. Did not – I saw it coming. I was like, “I'm not gonna nail this one,” and I did.
Julia: Proud of you.
Eric: Great. Excellent. He had the skeleton exhumed and reburied in the graveyard in town. He also did a little research in the town archives. It turns out there was a trapper who had a trapline that went through both my grandparents properties, including exactly where they built the house.
Julia: Oh, fuck.
Eric: After the reburial, there was no more occurrences of mysterious falling objects. And my father never saw anyone else at the end of his bed again that he could remember.
Julia: So, when he – when they said that he walked through the bed and then through the wall behind him, does that mean the ghosts walked through him?
Eric: I mean it – I mean, I, I guess, it depends on the angle of [Inaudible 13:35].
Julia: I supposed.
Eric: But I – yeah. I mean I think it's safe to assume yes.
Julia: Yeah.
Eric: Let’s – for, for the sake of – for the sake of spookiness, yes.
Julia: That is – that is the scariest thing. Ghosts passing through people does me a big scare.
Eric: Hmm. I don't know. I'm more scared of a ghost interacting with a physical object.
Julia: But, like, you are a physical object.
Eric: No, but, like, interacting.
Julia: Okay.
Eric: Not just, like, passing through. Like, knock – the knock – the knocking it off is scarier to me than if I just saw ghosts, like, walked through me. I mean I would have – to be clear, neither are good. But one I feel like is – I feel like I could be like, “Well, that was just a weird thing.” But, like, seeing the, the proof – the physical proof of something moving, no.
Amanda: Just like how ravens abilities to, like, make memories and relationships and use tools and stuff makes them the scariest and the most awesome bird.
Eric: Mhmm.
Amanda: I think that ghosts abilities to manipulate and to wield items, that makes it the scariest ghost apart from, obviously, ghosts that cause smells.
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: Yes.
Julia: Of course, the ghost that cause smell is the scariest of all.
Eric: I mean I'm still saying taste, but I, I --
Julia: You know what? It's fine. We can have differing opinions.
Eric: We can. We can. That's the great thing about the three of us.
Julia: Mhmm. Awesome. Well, I – speaking of Alaskan real estate, I have a follow up to our 50 Urban Legends from the 50 states episode, specifically, about Alaska.
Amanda: Let's hear it.
Eric: Nice.
Julia: So, this is sent in by Kale who sent in the subject line, Alaska Urban Legends. And he writes I just listened to the Urban Legends from All 50 States episode. And I want to let you know my favorite from my home, Alaska. I've been to the Kennecott Mine, by the way, very spooky. There's a ton of local urban legends from the towns I grew up in that I'm sure no one has taken the time to write down and put on the internet. A few highlights are a couple who fell to their death hiking and still haunt the cliff, a stone that, if removed from its resting place, will bring bad luck to the town, a gigantic lynx that lives in a lake and eats bad children named Kitty, which actually someone wrote into us about in an Urban Legends Episode before, and a government base experimenting with weaponized weather controlling technology.
Amanda: A lot going on there.
Eric: That's a lot. That's so many, like, just things happening. But I really – I'm interested in the, the weather control.
Julia: Listen, Alaska is huge. So, it makes sense that they have a lot – a lot of spooky stories to tell.
Eric: Mhmm.
Julia: So, he continues, my all-time favorite is the UAF tunnels. The University of Alaska Fairbanks at one point or another in the 70s and 80s started an infrastructure project aimed at linking the majority of the buildings on campus via a network of underground tunnels. My school up in Boston Northeastern also had these. And let me tell you, “Tunnels are spooky.” That's just a fact.
Eric: I hate a tunnel.
Julia: That's fair.
Eric: I – there's so many different types of tunnels; weird ones under community colleges, the one under the Denver Airport.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: I also hate driving in tunnels not because they're inherently creepy, but because I get very nervous driving in, like, very narrow lanes. And the Midtown Tunnel in New York City is the narrowest tunnel I have ever driven in. It sucks.
Julia: Yeah, it's spooky. I also don't like the – like, the flashing of lights when you're going through a tunnel.
Amanda: Yes.
Julia: That always kind of throws me off. And I don't enjoy it. Anyway, so, these tunnels were to provide a way for students to get from class to class safely and warmly despite the harsh winter temperatures. The project found early success and grew more ambitious.
Amanda: What is a good example of this though, Julia, is the raised walkways in Minneapolis. Love a raised walkway.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: Love a glass bridge connecting different buildings in Minneapolis. They're just there for people to get around with and not have to go outside in the winter.
Eric: A classic reverse tunnel.
Amanda: A classic reverse tunnel. Thank you, Eric. May the light be there.
Eric: It’s above ground and you could see it.
Amanda: No cars are in it. Just people.
Eric: Yep.
Julia: So, the project found early success and grew more ambitious. Layers were built on layers, shortcuts created, access points added in the most out of way places. The tunnels spider web, connecting nearly everything on campus regardless of distance or elevation change in a confusing mass of underground passages. This much is factually true.
Amanda: Incredible.
Julia: Stories vary on why the tunnels were sealed. And the explanations grew progressively more spooky. Some say the university ran out of money to heat their Labyrinthian creation. Others blame drug dealers who use the poorly lit and hard to navigate tunnels as a base of operations. Still others say that out of control 24/7 parties dominated the deepest parts of the tunnels night and day occasionally clogging regular foot traffic. One story that was particularly popular on campus when I attended was that of an undergrad who was murdered in the tunnels, which caused Fairbanks PD to shut the whole project down. She, of course, haunts the tunnels to this very day appearing in the dark to adventurous students. The most plausible reason for sealing the tunnels that I've come across is that the university shut the tunnels down to stop a rampaging zombie horde, which prows the bowels of the tunnels to this day hungry for the flesh of the bioengineering majors that first created them. Whatever really happened – cough, cough zombies – UAF started shutting the tunnels down at some point in the 90s. You can still see access points literally everywhere on campus. If you're on campus and see a set of locked iron doors that seemed to be set horizontally into the ground or into the side of a hill with no obvious building present or even a grated heating vent big enough to fit a staircase into one of the campus buildings, you've stumbled into a tunnel entrance. Once you start looking, they really are everywhere. These days the tunnels are mostly used for maintenance crews and equipment storage. There was, at least, one tunnel party in the 2010s and students still sneak down to explore occasionally. You can find a website where a former student has mapped out many of the tunnels and their access points as well as some dangerous areas. The new power plant uses some as exhaust vents. So, if you do go tunnel spelunking, be aware that there are more dangerous than just the zombies. Love your show.
Amanda: Very good.
Julia: It's very spooky. I love the incorporation of the zombies in there too because, like, if we had zombies, we probably would just try to lock them up in, like, a single place, right?
Amanda: Oh, 100 percent.
Julia: Just let them – just let them waste away.
Eric: No, that's why you do it.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: Now, just like those kind of classic to miss that we heard and I feel like a, a classic college tunnel story is fantastic. I have what I thought we were done with, an I was a creepy child email.
Julia: Love them.
Amanda: And we get lots of these. They are very fun. But we don't want to over saturate our audience with creepy children. But this one I thought was just, like, chef’s kiss. This comes from Emma titled, Succinctly, I was a creepy child. I can probably write a very long email about all the creepy things I did as a kid, but I will try and tell only the best ones. I've never been afraid of the dark and I've always enjoyed hiding in tight dark places like closets, and under beds, and under stairs.
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: Since I grew up in the middle of nowhere in rural Northern Scandinavia, there was little else to do during the days than to walk around in the woods. Guys, we did another great theming here of, like, Arctic Circle and Arctic Circle adjacent myths.
Julia: Oh, hell yeah.
Amanda: Since my grandmother would often take care of me during the day, I would spend a ton of time with her. When I was very little, apparently, I would ask her, “Grandmother, do you remember when you were young and I was old and we live together in a cabin in the woods?” Of course, she did not remember this and I no longer remember asking her either or why I even asked it. One of the creepiest things I would do as a small child was, before I got siblings, I would talk to my toys and to my imaginary friends. My favorite toy was a stuffed cow. I would always have her with me and have long chats while sitting on the ground. But, one day hanging out with other children, my dad saw me demonstrating how to butcher an animal using my beloved cow plush.
Julia: Oh.
Amanda: I mimicked cutting the throat to bleed her out, cutting off the legs, cutting up the torso, et cetera. Then I proceeded to show them how to cut up the different slices of meat.
Julia: Oh, no.
Amanda: I, apparently, have learned this from my dad, who hunts moose. But he never showed me how these things were done using a toy. I also don't think the other kids were bothered by my lecture in butchering, BTW.
Julia: Oh, boy.
Amanda: Even though I no longer actually hide under the stairs to scare my relatives, do have to fight against appearing creepy. When I moved from home at the age of 16 to go to my preferred school, I would often scare my roommates in my dormitory simply by saying hello. They just wouldn't hear me coming. So, I started putting bells on my keychain, backpack, and room door so people would know when I was near. I bet I'll become a really good ghost when I'm dead.
Julia: Probably.
Amanda: Kind regards, future creepy ghost, Emma.
Eric: I like the, the potential there.
Amanda: Oh, yeah, it's powerful.
Eric: Like, I'm gonna – I'm gonna be real spooky later on.
Julia: Be a good ghost.
Amanda: It's powerful and also very considerate. I feel like Emma will be a very considerate and helpful ghost.
Eric: Yeah.
Julia: Yes, I, I feel like that's true.
Amanda: Well, with that beautiful image in our heads, guys, let's go grab a refill.
Julia: All right. Let's do it.
Eric: Cannot wait.
Midroll Music
Amanda: Julia, we are sponsored this week by Skillshare. And I think, now more than ever, #nowmorethanever, it is very soothing for me to be able to kind of turn my brain off at night and read, or do puzzles, or cook, or take up some other hobby an activity that feels really like, like I’m making something, but it's not productivity.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: You know, that's a – I mean, it's a hobby. And, as people who work in creative fields, it can sometimes be really draining for your hobby to be now your career.
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: Which is why I really love that Skillshare kind of covers both. It teaches you skills that you can put to use at work or on your side hustle but also stuff that can just help you relax and be a well-rounded creative person. So, this week, I took the course, The 10 Principles of Painting in Daily Sketchbook Lessons by Amarilys Henderson.
Julia: Ooh.
Amanda: Who's a great watercolor artist with lots of other classes, by the way, including some about, like, DIY gifts, which I think is really fun this time of year.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: And it is just a fantastic class. Kind of teaching you bit by bit stuff about drawing that – I don't know – I never learned since, you know, elementary school art class. I feel like I'm kind of starting from scratch in a lot of ways with visual art. So, I really appreciate that she kind of breaks it down into daily lessons that feel very kind of low stakes. I'm not sitting down trying to, like, draw a portrait. I am trying to learn and grow. And Skillshare is just really good at that. The lessons are beautiful. They're well put together. The audio is good. The video doesn't buffer, you know. And it's really a kind of digestible lessons that are really fun to take. So, listen, come on. Come with me. Come on this journey. Explore your creativity at skillshare.com/spirits. The first thousand people to use our link will get a free trial of Skillshare premium membership. And you should go click it now and sign up for the membership. That's skillshare.com/spirits. The first thousand people will get a free trial of Skillshare premium membership.
Julia: Amanda, I feel like my go-to outfit for 2020 has just been, like, sweat pants and maybe an okay kind of shirt. And I don't love that. I'm not a huge fan. I like looking cute and dressing up in cute fashion and cute styles even if I'm just going to be, like, seeing you through computer. But, luckily, Stitch Fix is there to make sure that, even if I want to dress comfortably in my own home office, I can still look cute doing that.
Amanda: I love that.
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Amanda: Speaking of getting ready to go out in the world, Julia, I had a, an appointment recently. I got my jewelry changed and my cartilage piercing.
Julia: Mhmm. Nice.
Amanda: And, going into the studio, I was biking. And, so, I had a, a strange combination needing to be in kind of athletic wear but also needing to, like, being in front of people who are appearing very closely at my head. So, I really appreciated that I got to wear a bra that did not dig into me and feel bad but also was bra that I could wear --
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: -- out and about into the world. And that was a ThirdLove bra. I really, really love that they have seamless and wireless bras that, in this day and age, folks, wires are not necessary. If you don't want to wear one, you don't have to. And the seamless lounge bras specifically from ThirdLove is something that I have been absolutely living in these last few months.
Julia: I'm wearing one right now, by the way.
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Julia: So, ThirdLove knows there's a perfect bra for everyone. And, right now, they're offering our listeners 10 percent off your first order. So, go to thirdlove.com/spirits now to get your perfect fitting bra and get 10 percent off your first purchase.
Amanda: That's thirdlove.com/spirits for 10 percent off today. And, now, let's get back to the show.
Julia: So, guys, I have a beer. It's not my hometown beer because it comes out of Baltimore, Maryland from DuClaw Brewing. But I saw it when I went to the beer store the other day and I was gonna grab my usual SeaQuench and then it was right next to the SeaQuench. I was, like, pointing to the guy because they do with the, the service one rather than letting you wander through the shelves and picking out your things. But it was the No Way Gose, which is a --
Eric: Hmmm.
Julia: -- gose brewed with pineapple, lime, sea salt, and then aged in tequila barrels. And let me tell you, I like – I want it to be summer again. I like winter, but I want it to be summer again to, like, really get to enjoy this.
Amanda: I appreciate your extending gose season into November.
Julia: Mhmm. I love a sour beer.
Eric: Yeah.
Julia: It doesn't have to be warm to enjoy a sour beer. That's all I'm saying.
Amanda: I do have a relatively close to our hometown pick this week. I stopped into Bad Seed Cider --
Julia: Oh, hell yeah.
Amanda: -- which is in Highland, New York right by Poughkeepsie. And they make the absolute best pumpkin cider I have ever had. If you would describe that to me, I'd go like, “I don't know. Probably doesn't taste good.” But this – this is just like the purest, most amazing pumpkin taste. I love the cider because it's really dry. It's not very sugary. And they have a beautiful, like, farm – farm stand, basically, where you can go and do a tasting and, like, visit their tap room. But it's outdoors and an apple orchard. So, it was very good and socially distanced visiting that you can do in the fall.
Julia: Oh, that sounds beautiful and delicious.
Eric: I'm gonna come in with more of a, a hot take than a recommendation.
Julia: Wooh.
Amanda: Ooh.
Eric: Oktoberfest beers.
Julia: Hmm. Good shit.
Eric: They're better than pumpkin beers.
Julia: You know what? I agree with you because I'm not a huge pumpkin person. I, I like the concept of pumpkin spice.
Eric: Mhmm.
Julia: But I feel like the spice combo in an Oktoberfest beer is, like, exponentially better.
Amanda: You also have to, like, have a point of view for Oktoberfest. There's not just like we put some pumpkin tastes in there and then it's done. Like, you have to, I feel, kind of make some more active choices than, eh, it’s pumpkin beer or whatever.
Eric: I think part of this is definitely some level of, like, beer hipsterdom --
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: -- where it’s just like there were a few good pumpkin beers and then everyone made a pumpkin beer and, like, most of them are not good.
Julia: Hmm.
Eric: And, like, maybe it's just kind of easier to make an Oktoberfest even, even – like, even a very good [Inaudible 30:05], obviously, very skillfully made. But, like, I think the, the amount of bad pumpkin beers has hurt the flavor as a – as a concept at this point. I, I really like the local place Great Lakes Brewery. They have a great Oktoberfest. But, but I'm just saying, if you're looking – if you're look in the season and you were thinking about one of these funny, funny named pumpkin beers, maybe just look a bit to your left, look a bit to your right, up or down depending on where it might be on the shelf, grab [Inaudible 30:34] – grab the Oktoberfest instead maybe or grab both. You know what? Support your local business, support your local brewery. That's all I'm saying. Just – don't, don't just go for – don't just go for the pumpkin.
Julia: Well, Eric, I really appreciate that you're encouraging people to try new things. But I do have one that specifically is a Eric-safe story for you. So, are you ready for it? It's very – it is kind of cute, kind of creepy. That’s a good way to describe it.
Eric: Yeah. Yeah, I'm ready.
Julia: So, this --
Eric: I'm always ready.
Julia: So, this comes from Kara. And they say, hey, everyone, longtime listener, first time writer. Honestly, I didn't even remember this story until I was caught up on the backlog of Urban Legends Episodes. But then, again, it's been a while since I was in the sixth grade. To set the scene, the sixth grade class was going to a history museum in Cleveland for a field trip. There is an aviation wing many of us were excited to see after we got through the “class portion” of the trip, but it was closed that day. Because of this, everyone was eating lunch in the atrium. One of the student’s mom, who was our sub during the time, took myself and a couple of the boys to go see if we could look through the garage doors at the planes. That seems like it would be fine, right? Six to seven 12-year-olds and one of their mothers peeking through darkened garage doors at planes. Well, all of a sudden, as we tried to focus on a propeller plane near the door, a spotlight appeared to hit a roughly hewn wooden statue of Jesus. Again, we were in a history museum looking at planes. No religion evolved. So, we did what many children would do; jump in the air, scream, and bolt back to where the rest of the class was. I know it wasn't just me who saw it because all of the guys were equally freaked out. But everyone essentially forgot about it after the fact. I think we all must have gone with the, “Ignored it. It's fine” policy. I also have a little bonus side story involving the tooth fairy. Definitely debunked like other stories previously told and definitely not spooky. But it's a fairy and we could all use a palate cleanser between some non-Eric safe stories, right? So, I'm the eldest child and when I lost my first tooth at five, like all little kids, we were told about the tooth fairy. I was excited and actually happen to wake up when, “The tooth fairy came into my room.” It just looked like a tiny ball of light floating towards my closet at the end of the room. And I, of course, had to tell everyone the next day that I saw her. In reality, it was totally my father being just lucky enough that I wasn't wholly conscious. And it was just dark enough that I only saw his 2003 cell phone screen. So, I didn't ruin it for myself and my little sister. But it allowed for several more years of believing in the childhood legend because of that moment. I love the idea of a 2003 probably, like, Razr phone just lighting up the sky and you're like, “Oh, it's a fairy,” because I'm partially awake and, also, I'm five. It's very good.
Amanda: Very good.
Eric: I think that, if this was in Cleveland, this might have been a museum that my parents visited just last summer.
Julia: Ooh.
Eric: I'm pretty sure
Julia: Was there a roughly hewn Jesus?
Eric: I don't know about that. I did not go. But there's a few places where there might be airplanes. I don't – I, I think there's, like, one that – like, it's a big, like, hangar kind of thing --
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: -- somewhere. Not in Cleveland proper, but, like, around there. I, I did a quick search and wasn't able to find it immediately. But, yeah, I mean I, I don't remember. Maybe, when, when times are normal, I'll go and check it out to see if I can find a weird crucifix in the airplanes museum.
Julia: A weird hewn --
Eric: That's a fun little exploration some, some Saturday or Sunday.
Julia: That sounds fun. I love it.
Eric: But – yeah. That’s – yeah, that's, that's funny. I've got a real Scandinavian story.
Eric: Whoa. Not one of those fake one.
Amanda: Keeping the theme.
Eric: Yeah. I like – I like this one because you can interpret it as either compared to a fake one as Julia did or like this is one of those real Scandinavian. All those other Scandinavian story are posers. This one, this is the real.
Julia: The real shit.
Eric: It also felt like a good time to read this one because I believe the new Assassin's Creed Valhalla is releasing --
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: -- in – either it has or is about to release with all the new systems this week. So, felt like the right time to give our, our listeners a, a little – a real Scandinavian story.
Amanda: Real Scandinavian --
Julia: Cool.
Amanda: -- stories only.
Julia: Let's do it.
Eric: This comes from Emma and she writes, my story is not an Urban Legend, but it is a family legend.
Julia: Wooh.
Amanda: Okay. Okay. Okay.
Eric: As a kid growing up in Northern Sweden, our house was a half an hour away from the tiny town. And there was only one store, which is now closed.
Julia: Uh, uh.
Eric: Growing up in the middle of the forest, I felt really close to our Scandinavian myths and would always keep away from trolls, witches, and nokken while exploring. There's a lot of symbols in this one.
Julia: Mhmm.
Eric: So, I'm probably, probably wrong about that.
Julia: I think we might have talked about this before. It's the same thing as like the Neck, which is --
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: -- kind of like a water forest spirit.
Eric: Right. Yeah. My grandmother would often take care of me during the day since my mother was studying and my dad had to be gone for weeks at a time because he was a carpenter. My grandmother was tired of my unending energy. She would ask me to go out to the field to cut the hair of our field troll.
Amanda: Ahhh.
Eric: It was the biggest tuft of grass on the entire field. And I believe, with all of my heart, that it was a real creature.
Julia: Oh, boy.
Amanda: Incredible.
Eric: [Inaudible 36:03] or a water nymph would dance on the lake surface early in the morning and late in the evenings as well as on the fields. My story is not about these creatures, but, to me, it is as scary as one nonetheless.
Julia: I really like – this seems like a very magical childhood that you have. And I appreciate that.
Eric: Yeah, it’s very nice.
Julia: I like when children – one, I like that we can grow up in societies where we have these folkloric traditions that we can pass down from generation to generation. But I also really love just the, the magical world that children exist in.
Eric: Yeah.
Julia: Like, I think that's something that it's sad that we lose that as adults.
Eric: So, he – so, that was the – that was the preface. And, now, we're – now, we're in the real story from Emma.
Julia: Oh, hell yeah.
Eric: Me and my grandmother were gathering berries not far from the house.
Julia: This – ahhh.
Eric: I must not have been older than three years old. But I have heard this story so many times that I feel as if I remember it. My dad was home making dinner. He was fond of playing pranks on us. So, when we heard someone rustling through the leaves behind us, we thought it was him trying to play a trick on us.
Julia: Uh, uh.
Eric: We pretended not to hear him and continue to pick berries. He never revealed himself. So, we figured he had gone back to the house. Soon after, we hear whistling. We figured it was my dad telling us dinner was ready.
Julia: Uh, umm.
Eric: So, we made our way back.
Julia: Uh, umm.
Eric: When we entered the house, my dad was surprised to see us but pleased since dinner was in fact almost ready. My grandmother asked if it was him we had heard earlier and that had whistled. He said no. He had been making dinner ever since we left.
Julia: Uh, uh.
Eric: The next day, my dad went back to where we were picking berries and found the footprints of two bear cubs and, further down, those of an adult bear.
Julia: Oh, no.
Amanda: Oh, no.
Eric: So, it turns out the rustling we heard were the cubs playing and the whistling was that of the mother bear calling out to her cubs.
Amanda: Oh, wow.
Julia: Do bears whistle?
Amanda: Maybe like through the teeth. You know, the sort of, like, lower --
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: Like, bellows through the teeth.
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: Wow. That is a dangerous time to meet a bear.
Eric: Yeah.
Julia: Yeah.
Eric: Yeah. The --
Julia: Especially near berries. They probably want to eat those berries.
Eric: This is a true story. Scandinavian brown bear mothers do actually whistle when calling their cubs.
Amanda: Whoa.
Julia: Whoa.
Eric: So, this is why humans should never whistle in the forest.
Julia: Ahhh.
Eric: Otherwise, you might find yourself between a mother and her cubs. And that is something you would not want to do. Trust me.
Amanda: Aww.
Eric: Hope you find this story interesting even if it did not include any supernatural elements. Sometimes, the natural world is the scariest of them all.
Julia: Well, that's really interesting too because there's so many I feel like Scandinavian and Eastern European stories about like, “Don't whistle because,” and then there's various reasons.
Eric: Mhmm. Yeah.
Julia: Like, if you're a sailor, it'll cause the wind to come. Or, if you're whistling, you'll lose part of your soul or, like, attracts the devil or something like that. So, I like this practical use of don't whistle.
Amanda: Me too. It also --
Eric: Yeah.
Amanda: --I think is a – is a good corollary to what I'm sure has happened in the past, which is like somebody is annoyed by the sound of whistling when their kid learns to whistle. And it's just like, “Don't do that. Why? The devil will come.”
Julia: I love that. It's very, very cool.
Amanda: Eric, that was awesome. My final story for the episode comes from Zee who writes about ghost cows and fay sheep dog, A Fun Weekend Romp.
Julia: Wooh. Tell me. Tell me more. I love a, a sheep dog.
Amanda: Hey, friends, I had a fun experience a couple weeks ago when hiking in the Jemez Mountains of Northern New Mexico. My fiancé and I live in Central New Mexico with our two cats, Jiji and Iota, and our Great Pyrenees/various other sheep dogs/Pitbull mutt, Lambda.
Julia: These are great pet names.
Amanda: Extremely so.
Julia: Poor Jiji though. Doesn't get the cool Greek letter name.
Amanda: It's J-I-J-I. So, it’s possible it's pronounced slightly more interestingly.
Julia: Ohh, maybe.
Amanda: But all of these names are great. Lambda loves to go on walks and she is easily the best hiking dog I've ever had. So, we'd like to let her off the leash and she zooms back and forth all around us, never letting us out of her sight. She's also completely and irrationally afraid of several harmless things such as stairs – she'd never been up – anything metal that happens to also be touching concrete or asphalt like sewer gates, gutters, manholes, and crosswalk curbs. Because most of her fears are metal based, I believe she's part fay, which would also explain her absolute love for going with us into the wilderness.
Julia: I love that. By the way, Jiji is the cat from Kiki's Delivery Service. I love it.
Amanda: Aww.
Julia: Make sense.
Amanda: I think Iota is also a great name for a – for a cat.
Julia: It is.
Eric: I like it. Yeah.
Amanda: A couple weeks ago, my fiancé and I read on the internet, which never lies about anything ever.
Julia: No.
Amanda: That the aspens in the Jemez Mountains would be peeking with their fall colors. So, that's Sunday we packed some lunch, put Lambda in the backseat, and made a day trip out of it. We were fairly familiar with the area having camped there far from other people earlier in the summer. When we were camping, we found a trail that was deserted and contained hellah aspens, the scientific term for a lot of aspens, growing over the bones of burnt trees that fell during a forest fire about a decade ago. But, as we drove up to it, we noticed a bunch of cars and people without masks, sigh. So, we were discouraged. But, not ready to give up, we kept driving and eventually found a turnoff to a trail that contains no other cars or humans.
Julia: Nope.
Amanda: It led into – it led into a sort of gully.
Eric: Uh, umm.
Amanda: In the middle of which, a stream was flowing. Now, Julia, would you find it? Do you, like, have instinctively sort of, like, cross the stream or don't cross the stream instinct here?
Julia: I love running water in nature. It is like it --
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: -- something in my weird animal brain just gets real excited about, like, fast moving streams.
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: So, I would be like, “I want to stick my hands in it.”
Amanda: Yeah. I feel like, because of – I don't know if it's a myth or not. But, like, losing the scent trail for bloodhounds, I feel like I instinctively want to cross the river.
Julia: Yes.
Amanda: But then also it's like, “Oh, no, something bad happens.” Will that confuse the bloodhounds that will inevitably be called?
Julia: There's also a lot of different myths about, like, demons and certain, like, malevolent figures not being able to cross running water. So, I think that is a good instinct to have, Amanda.
Amanda: True. Thank you. We followed it uphill for a while and noticing a cow trail and plenty of cow patties for us to keep Lambda from rolling in. After enjoying our beautiful but otherwise uneventful hike, we turned around and headed back to the car. But, on the last stretch before the road, we noticed something that we hadn't before. Any guesses here?
Julia: A skulls. Skulls.
Eric: Hmm. What was – what – what – what was the name of the story going in?
Amanda: It was ghost cows and a fay sheep dog.
Eric: I mean it could be either of those. I guess that might be too obvious of a – of a hint.
Julia: Mhmm. Mhmm.
Eric: Oh, yeah. I – I’m – yeah, I'm – I’m gonna go with a sheep dog.
Amanda: Well, it was a large collection of wooden posts arranged in a circle about 100 feet wide.
Eric: That's no good. That's worse.
Julia: Well, that's fine when like you – if, if there was cows nearby, because they talked about keeping the dog out of rolling in the cow shit, I – it's probably like the remains of the old, like, pasture or something.
Amanda: See, Julia, that's very logical. I thought, “Ah, wooden Stonehenge.” All right.
Julia: Unexplainable.
Eric: I'm just thinking this is some kind of spell being cast.
Julia: Hmm.
Eric: But, instead of like chalk, they've used – they've used a bunch of stakes --
Julia: Sure.
Eric: -- made out, out in some – in some pattern.
Amanda: Well, it's a good instinct because I snapped a couple pics of it. And we approach to get a closer look. As we got closer, we noticed the posts were wrapped in wire. So, there you go, Julia, with your theory.
Julia: Mhmm.
Amanda: So, I, having a little bit of experience with cattle ranching, figured it must be the remnants of an old and beaten down corral from some time ago. My fiancé said, “Neat,” and we stepped into the circle.
Eric: Nope.
Amanda: The instant that we stepped in --
Eric: Yeah.
Amanda: -- a couple of things happened at once. Lambdas hackles went up and she backed away from the nearest post. And she hadn’t been acting strangely whatsoever until that point. And the wind picked up. Then, on the opposite side of the circle – I would guess about 300 feet or so away from where we were – a large tree fell down with a loud crack and crashed into the ground.
Julia: Listen, I don't – I don't yell at our listeners very often. I don’t scold our listeners very often. Eric: That’s not true. Not true at all. Like, literally, 20 percent of these episodes is us yelling at our listeners.
Julia: Sometimes, y'all do some things that make me question whether or not you listen to this show.
Amanda: Well, this was Zee’s fiancé’. So, it's possible that they don't know. And, now, they both have to listen to the show together.
Julia: Okay.
Amanda: After a couple seconds of stunned silence, we wordlessly agreed on the best and most logical course of action. We galloped in a circle around the perimeter of the corral, yelled giddy up and moo, and then turned around and left without turning back.
Julia: What? Why? What?
Amanda: This sounds like a fun couple.
Eric: Sure.
Amanda: Afterwards, I figured the ghosts of the cows that used to be corralled there didn't like trespassers so they kindly felled an old tree in order to communicate that with us.
Julia: I guess.
Amanda: I believe we made good.
Julia: I guess kindly felling trees in the most horrifying way possible.
Amanda: What if it falls on them? I believe we made the right choice because, right before we reached our car, a crow feather fell from the sky and landed directly in front of me. I'm just a baby gender queer pagan, but I took that to be a good sign and kept the feather.
Julia: This is too many signs that you fucked up somehow. Please be careful.
Amanda: I think the – that you just live dangerously and I appreciate it very much.
Julia: Ahhh.
Eric: I like it. Let's – let’s live dangerously.
Julia: What? No. You are --
Amanda: I’m all for it.
Julia: You are a team ignorant. You are not allowed to say, “Oh, yes, let's live dangerously.”
Eric: Once again, I've clarified myself many times. I will not get caught up in this partisan ghost hunting.
Julia: All right. Fine.
Eric: If the thing isn’t gonna go away by ignoring it, why not check it out?
Amanda: Well, guys, I have a very fun roundup of scary stories from India Part 2 from Ginny. But I want to save that for our patron-only bonus Urban Legends Episode that we're about to record.
Julia: Ohhh. That was a really good one. I'm excited to see what the follow up is.
Eric: Yeah.
Amanda: Me too.
Eric: Can’t wait.
Amanda: But thank you everybody for writing in. And we love reading these. Keep sending them at spiritspodcast.com/contact.
Julia: Yes, please do. I love reading these.
Amanda: So, whether or not you decide to step into the ghost corrals that you find on your hikes. Remember.
Julia: Stay creepy.
Amanda: Stay cool.
Julia: Make better choices.
Amanda: No.
Theme Music
Amanda: Thanks again to our sponsors. At skillshare.com/spirits, the first thousand people to use that link will get a free trial of Skillshare premium membership. At stitchfix.com/spirits, you'll get 25 percent off when you keep your whole box. And, at thirdlove.com/spirits, you can get 10 percent off your first order.
Outro Music
Amanda: Spirits was created by Amanda McLoughlin, Julia Schifini, and Eric Schneider with music by Kevin MacLeod and visual design by Allyson Wakeman.
Julia: Keep up with all things creepy and cool by following us @SpiritsPodcast on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and Tumblr. We also have all of our episode transcripts, guest appearances, and merch on our website as well as a form to send us your urban legends at spiritspodcast.com.
Amanda: Join our member community on Patreon, patreon.com/spiritspodcast, for all kinds of behind-the-scenes stuff. Just $1 gets you access to audio extras with so much more available too; recipe cards, director’s commentaries, exclusive merch, and real physical gifts.
Julia: We are a founding member of Multitude, a collective of independent audio professionals. If you like Spirits, you will love the other shows that live on our website at multitude.productions.
Amanda: And, above all else, if you liked what you heard today, please share us with your friends. That is the very best way to help us keep on growing.
Julia: Thank you so much for listening. Till next time.
Transcriptionist: Rachelle Rose Bacharo
Editor: Krizia Casil