Episode 343: The Other Gods of Norse Mythology
/There’s so many gods and goddesses in Norse mythology! But sadly not a lot of surviving stories about them. So we did a quick roundup to tell you about some of our favorite stories of the lesser known Vanir and Aesir!
Content Warning: This episode contains conversations about or mentions of war, violence, death, animal attacks, dismemberment, bugs, birth and labor, genitals,
Housekeeping
- Recommendation: This week, Amanda recommends Planthropology Pod and Dr. Vikram Baliga’s TikTok!
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- Call to Action: Check out Exolore, where Dr. Moiya McTier explores fictional worlds by building them with a panel of expert guests, interviewing professional worldbuilders, or reviewing the merits of worlds that have already been built.
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Transcript
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AMANDA: Welcome to Spirits Podcast, a boozy dive into mythology, legends, and folklore. Every week we pour a drink and learn about a new story from around the world. I'm Amanda.
JULIA: And I'm Julia.
AMANDA: And today I have heard Julia, is another installment of Its Norse Of course, who are we going to be learning about?
JULIA: Well, Amanda, here's the thing. Now that we're several episodes into Its Norse, of Course, there are a lot of Norse Gods, there's just a lot of them.
AMANDA: Yes, true.
JULIA: There are mentioned throughout the Poetic and the Prose Edda's and various other historical sources. But sometimes these gods are only briefly mentioned or mentioned in passing. They don't have as much background as someone like Odin or Thor or Freya, and they don't feature as heavily in some of the important stories like Loki and Baldur. But just because there isn't a lot of material that has been preserved about them, it doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about them. So for this episode, we're going to briefly touch on some of the other important Vanir and Aesir that we just don't have as much original source material about.
AMANDA: Hell yeah. Love it, love a round-up.
JULIA: So we're just gonna get right into it because we got a couple of gods to get through. And I also want to mention that this is going to be just the gods. There's a lot of other figures in Norse mythology that are as we talked about, like the Jotunn, the giants, the dwarves, bunch of different types of figures, but not necessarily Gods. So this is just the Gods round up, and then maybe next time we touch on Its Norse Of Course, we'll touch a little bit more on those other figures that play important roles.
AMANDA: Hell, yeah.
JULIA: And Amanda, as always, I know these are going to be a little bit shorter, and you won't have as much information, but I would love to hear your epithets on these various gods that we're going to talk about today.
AMANDA: You got it. I was thinking about mapping each of them to like, for example, the Applebee's appetizer platter because that is kind of like the roundup of foods if you think about it. So if you're open to both Julia, I would love to do that.
JULIA: I would love to hear about [laughs] the mozzarella stick.
AMANDA: Right.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: Somebody's gonna be the spinach artichoke [2:33] the best.
JULIA: Of course.
AMANDA: Like I'm not sure who it's gonna be yet.
JULIA: Naturally. Alright, so yes, we'll do the—how about we do the roundup of Applebee's appetizers at the end?
AMANDA: Great.
JULIA: And then you can give me epithets when we finish each of these.
AMANDA: Hell yeah.
JULIA: Amanda, amazing idea.
AMANDA: I love I can still surprise you 8 years in Jul?
JULIA: Oh, truly, truly. How many ever years into our friendship at this point?
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: God, I can't even think about how many years—
AMANDA: Don't—don't think about it. Shhhshhh, shhhshhh. Julia, shhh.
JULIA: 16, I think. 16, something like that. Alright, so [3:04]
AMANDA: Honey, we're 31 minus 5.
JULIA: 26, 26 years. Fuck, fuck. I just thought about that, I'm like, no, I didn't meet Amanda 2 years before Jake and I started dating, that doesn't make sense. Oh, boy, okay. We're gonna start first with Tyr. So Tyr is either the son of the Jotunnheimr or the son of Odin, depending on the story that's being told. And he is both a War God and a sky god. Though perhaps not as bloodthirsty as we often try to make the war gods out to be. Like, if you're going to compare him to Aries, you're wrong, is basically what I'm saying. So it was said that Tyr was the bravest of the gods and was highly concerned with justice, especially fair treaties made when war was done.
AMANDA: A good thing to have a God about.
JULIA: Oh, absolutely. And we'll talk a little bit about this like because Tyr's symbolism and connection to war is very different from the other War Gods we've talked about. And there's a reason behind that. Some scholars believe that despite the fact that by the time the Norse myths were recorded in like the Prose Edda and the Poetic Edda, Tyr's importance had been somewhat diminished. But there is some indication that Tyr might have been a more important figure than Odin at some point. But as we've seen in other traditions, sometimes the importance of Gods shifts depending on who is in power or like cultural shifts.
JULIA: Sure. It's really important to note that, despite Tyr being a War God, he's definitely not only a War God. Like as I mentioned before, he was typically put in the place of an upholder of law or justice. And this is particularly highlighted in Tyr's role in the story of the binding of Fenrir which is one of the few stories that we have that features Tyr's prominently that has survived into modernity. As you might remember, Fenrir was the dreaded wolf son of Loki. He was a giant monster wolf man.
AMANDA: Hmm.
JULIA: So when Fenrir was just a pup, the gods realized that he was growing extremely quickly, and also would soon become extremely deadly. And that was a concern for the gods.
AMANDA: Like my very petite mother-in-law, who adopted a sweet puppy and soon realized he was a Great Dane.
JULIA: Mmm, mmm. Turned out to be a big dog, you can tell by the paws. They looked at those paws and they're like that paws like the size of the moon, we should be concerned.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: So the gods feared for their lives, obviously. So they decided that they would have to bind Fenrir so that he could not escape and cause chaos basically. So when they came to Fenrir, and the wolf saw the chains that would bind him, he was obviously a little suspicious of that. So he declared that he would allow the gods to put the chains around him, but only if one of them would stick an arm in his mouth as a sign of good faith.
AMANDA: I mean, it's kind of an elegant like standoff, right? Because like, if— if it's clear that they're doing something untoward, then you know—
JULIA: [5:58]
AMANDA: [5:58] your arms away. Yeah.
JULIA: Snip, snip, chop, chop. Great. So Tyr again, the bravest of the gods was the only one who was willing to take up this challenge, right? So he placed his arm in the mouth of Fenrir, and the gods bound the wolf. And when Fenrir found that he could not break free of these chains, he bit off Tyr's arm in his rage and for revenge.
AMANDA: I mean, yeah, I can see how that ends.
JULIA: Yeah. And I mean, so this is a big deal, Amanda, because the binding of Fenrir is tied to Ragnarok and the end of the gods. And I truly love, I found this quote, it's fantastic. A comparative religion scholar named Jorge Demoiselle, he puts it, quote, ‘Tyr, with his sacrifice, not only procures the salvation of the gods but also regularizes it. He renders legal that which without him would be pure fraud.” So basically, this idea of Tyr by giving up his hand, being brave enough to sacrifice his arm in order to vouch for the rest of the gods, he was able to save the world, because Tyr is so trustworthy in that way. Because he is this God of justice and God of treaties, he is able to legitimize what the gods are doing by his sacrifice.
AMANDA: Wow, it's big deal.
JULIA: It is a big deal. And like a big deal for not only like the Norse mythology as a whole but also a big deal for like Norse society and culture. And like the idea of what laws are legal and where legality comes from for Norse mythology.
AMANDA: Huge deal.
JULIA: And this also, interestingly, in a way, puts him on par with Odin. Because like, much like Odin showed himself to be the foremost God of Wisdom by sacrificing his eye in the pursuit of knowledge, Tyr also showed himself to be the foremost god of law by sacrificing his arm to uphold it.
AMANDA: It's really interesting. And I—I think very often the like, American conception of justice is that everybody is owed it, right? And like, nobody should have to give up anything in order to uphold the law. And only people who try to transgress against it morally, or not, like rightfully or not, people who are seen to be outside the law or opposed to it are the ones who should, you know suffer and lose. And so the idea that you know, instead of like valorizing, and enriching, let's say, people who are in charge of enforcing or upholding or creating laws, instead, you give up something meaningful in order to kind of prove that you're worthy of setting or maintaining it. It's pretty radical, it's pretty different.
JULIA: I think Tyr is one of the most interesting gods of Norse mythology, and it's kind of a shame that not a lot of like sources have survived to modernity about him. Because I think that his stories really showcase something about Norse culture and society that a lot of people tend to overlook.
AMANDA: Fascinating.
JULIA: So Amanda, speaking of all of this, you're probably wondering, you're like, okay, how is this God of law and justice, also one of the Norse War Gods? You would probably like think if you're listening to this, these two areas are somewhat unrelated to each other or like act in opposition to each other. But for the ancient Germanic people, war, and law were intrinsically tied together. So to explain this a little further, I'll quote the Phil Loges, John De Vries. Quote, “it should be noted that for the dramatic point of view, there is no contradiction between the concepts of God of War and God of law. War is in fact, not only the bloody mingling of combat, but no less a decision obtained between the two combatants and secured by precise rules of law.” That is why the day and place of battle are frequently fixed in advanced. So is explained also how combat between two armies can be replaced by a legal duel, in which the gods grant victory to the party whose right they recognize. Words like [9:54] which is the meeting of two swords, a kenning of battle, or the Old Norse Vapin Dormer, judgment of arms are not poetic figures but correspond exactly with ancient practice. So I love this because I really think it's like okay, so not only is war like a highly like legalize, there are rules of war even for the ancient Germanic people. And so Tyr was in charge of the like, literal rules and laws of war concept of war. So it's really interesting because Tyr represents this one part as opposed to the other parts of war. So like, Thor, if you think about it, is this brute physical force that's used in war. Odin is kind of like the psychological strategy of war. And then Tyr is the legal decisions and principles of justice that surround the art of war.
AMANDA: Makes sense when you put it that way, but you're right when I hear God of War and God of law, I think huh, haven't seen one of those before, you know?
JULIA: Yes. And so I really, really love this idea that Tyr is kind of this. Not only the laws that like drive life but also the laws that drive war, which was a pretty big aspect of life in the early Norse culture. So Amanda, that's—that's Tyr for us. Do we have a epithet we think we like for Tyr?
AMANDA: Yes, I—okay, so the first thing that came to mind was like, technical.
JULIA: Cool.
AMANDA: Because he sounds very precise. And I think that setting the boundaries of what counts and what doesn't, right and like what you know, what—what's fair war and what's not. But I think that doesn't really capture the, you know, the feeling of him. So, tactile.
JULIA: I was thinking, Tyr the trustworthy?
AMANDA: It's good.
JULIA: Because he's always following the rules. And like the fact that he—by sacrificing his arm, made it seem like the gods were trustworthy enough in order to bind Fenrir, seems like a kind of fun one in my mind.
AMANDA: Let's do it!
JULIA: Alright, Tyr the trustworthy.
AMANDA: I love it.
JULIA: So another god that we haven't touched on, but might be familiar to some of our conspirators is Heimdall. So Heimdall is one of the aesir, he is best known for being the Guardian ever vigilant of Asgard. And much like we've talked about with the other gods, Heimdall's hall is called Himinbjorg, which literally translates to the sky cliffs. And as the name somewhat suggests, it sits high on top of the Bifrost, which we haven't really talked about yet on Its Norse Of Course, but this is the rainbow bridge that leads to Asgard.
AMANDA: Iconic from the Marvel movies. Is the only reason I know about it.
JULIA: That's honestly, fair. Iconic from the Marvel movies, doesn't have the kind of like teleportation magic of the Marvel movies. But again, like you know, they took a lot of liberties with those films, as we've talked about before.
AMANDA: Yep.
JULIA: Amanda, you'll—you'll start to notice a pattern as I tell you more and more about Heimdall. So his whole thing basically is he is the watcher, he is the guardian for the gods. And it was said that he very rarely slept. He had eyesight that was so keen, he could see four hundreds of miles by day or by night. His hearing is so good that he can hear the grass growing in the ground and wool growing on sheep, which I think is such it, like, adorable, kind of be like, ah, yes, the sheep, they're almost ready to harvest because I can hear the wool growing on them.
AMANDA: I mean, that also sounds very overwhelming, and I probably wouldn't sleep either, if I could hear the individual grass growing.
JULIA: That's true, that's true. I've imagined just being like, you know, last year, we had a cricket problem in our house. So the crickets were like—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —keeping me awake because it felt like they were right underneath my head.
AMANDA: Oh, boy.
JULIA: And I just imagined that times a 100?
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Would drive me wild.
AMANDA: Or you know that—that dad joke where they're like, oh, I actually get my hair cut. And then they're like, just one or like all of them.
JULIA: Just one hair.
AMANDA: [13:57]. And Heimdall be like, yes, and I hear them all individually. Falls to the floor.
JULIA: And it's terrifying.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: It's so much.
AMANDA: Hate them scream.
JULIA: So he as you can imagine, Amanda is quite literally always watching and listening. And by his side is the horn—Gjallarhorn, which means the resounding horn, which he sounds if there's ever a threat approaching Asgard.
AMANDA: Sure, good.
JULIA: Constantly on the lookout for threats approaching Asgard. But besides this role as the watcher and the guardian of Asgard, we don't really know a ton about Heimdall. We think that he was maybe associated with rams, that we're not entirely sure why they connect the two other than the fact that he has this kind of like, Ram horn that he can sound to alert people. Heimdall's also associated with something called the [14:43] which literally translates to either scream, cry, or silence.
AMANDA: What?!
JULIA: I know, it's a—
AMANDA: Which one?!
JULIA: Both apparently.
AMANDA: Wow.
JULIA: And it's not only that, but it is also something that is a physical thing because it is said in certain sources to be hidden beneath the World Tree, Yggdrasil, near where Odin, was said to have sacrificed his eye. And again, we're not entirely sure what it is other than that it is an object.
AMANDA: Wow.
JULIA: Some scholars think it might be a reference to the Gjallarhorn, some think it might be his literal ear, which if in that case, Heimdall much like Tyr and Odin, might have sacrificed that part of his body in order to gain his incredible hearing that helps him be the watcher.
AMANDA: Makes sense.
JULIA: Which I think is just like really nice. I—I really think that it's interesting this idea of the Norse love this concept of you need to sacrifice something in order to become more than yourself. Like we see it with Odin, we see it with Tyr, and now potentially with Heimdall. And I really liked the idea of, I don't know, like everything requires something in order to gain it. And I think that's something that not as unique to Norse mythology, but it's central to Norse mythology.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: There is one reference to Heimdall's origins in the Poetic Edda, which is more than we can say of several Gods featured in this episode. But it was said that one day, Odin was walking along the seashore and he came across nine beautiful giantesses, who are known as the Wave Maidens who were the daughter of the sea god, Aegir. Now they were and there's nine of them, so give me a second. Alta who was named meant fury, Angeyja Eyrgjafa which the sand-strewer.
AMANDA: Woah.
JULIA: Eyrgjafa, sorrow-whelmer. Eistla, foamer, Gjalp, howler, Greip, the gripper, Jarnsaxa, Ironstone, Cinder, dusk, and Ulfrun, the sea wolf. And they were all so beautiful that Odin married all nine of them together.
AMANDA: Wow!
JULIA: Amanda, do you have a preference as to if you were had to be named one of these wave maidens, which one you would prefer?
AMANDA: I mean, sand-strewer is pretty sick.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: But I mean, it's gotta be seawolf, right? Like, just objectively the best one.
JULIA: I was I—you know what, I was also thinking Seawolf that was my go-to as well, so.
AMANDA: Yeah. I think you—you do Seawolf, and I'll do Sand-Strewer.
JULIA: I think both of them are good. I also really liked Jansarxa, the Iron-stone is pretty neat as well.
AMANDA: It is very, very cool.
JULIA: All nine of these ladies get married to Odin. And then from the nine of them brought forth Heimdall. So it's not specified how this birth happened.
AMANDA: Sure, sure, sure, don't worry about it.
JULIA: But what we know is that these nine ladies somehow together gave birth to Heimdall.
AMANDA: I mean, listen, I'm sure anyone who's gone through labor would prefer to have done 1/9 of that from my understanding. So they can share it. Great.
JULIA: Incredible. Yeah, yeah. I wish I could share it with—with I guess my sister's wives now is this case. So as a child, Heimdall was nurtured by the strength of the Earth, the moisture of the sea, the heat of the sun, and grew so strong and so big that he very quickly joined the other gods where he was put in charge of the Bifrost and the safety of Asgard. So Amanda, for Heimdall, what do you think in for the epithet there?
AMANDA: Oh, Heimdall the Herald, I think.
JULIA:: Yeah.
AMANDA: Because he—he is watching, waiting. And when the moment comes, he is there to blow his mighty ram's horn. I am so—by the way, as you may know, Julia, in Judaism, there is a ram's horn called the Shofar that we use to signal the beginning of Yom Kippur and some other uses, but that's— that's the main one. And the idea is that it's like a just resonant call from the heavens, to call you to repent.
JULIA: Nice.
AMANDA: And like that, you know, Yom Kippur is when we like, take stock of our life and our choices and whether or not we're going to be inscribed in the book of the living or the dead, and, you know, have a 24 hour period of fasting and self-reflection and making amends and reaching out to those that we've harmed, to say, like, hey, you know, most of the year, this shit is not on my mind. Today, it is only on my mind. And I am not, you know, bathing or drinking or eating. Because, like, it is serious and life is serious, and like this shit is calling me to account. And so I— I love the idea of somewhere Heimdall and like, you know, medieval rabbis, like Shofar shopping in the same—the same shop.
JULIA: Yeah. And really the opposite of Catholicism where you're meant to feel guilty and want to repent all the time. Constantly.
AMANDA: Yeah, yeah.
JULIA: So Amanda, we're gonna touch on one more God that we've mentioned in past episodes, but haven't really dug into which is Hermod, who is your favorite archetype in mythology, the hot messenger guy.
AMANDA: Yay!
JULIA: So Hermod is one of the sons of Odin whose name roughly comes from the phrase fury of war, combined with excitement, wrath, and passion.
AMANDA: Oh, damn. Okay.
JULIA: Which is like, I love the combination of those things. You're like yeah, yeah Hermod, that's great, I love it.
AMANDA: You think he ever has an off day and he's like, no fuck. Everyone just expects me to be fury and wrath and passion, but I feel kind of meh today.
JULIA: Yeah, like I just can't make up the excitement that I should be feeling that is like—
AMANDA: Right?
JULIA: —it's like my name, you know?
AMANDA: What's wrong with me? That's the first thing I think.
JULIA: So Amanda, as the—the hot messenger for the gods, he is considered one of the boldest and the bravest among them, not as brave as Tyr though. He is, as you might remember the one that volunteered to go to Hel's realm to ask her to release Baldur and let him return to Asgard. Hermod is also said to stand by Odin's side at the gates of Valhalla welcoming the dead heroes who have been brought to the hall by the Valkyries. And we'll talk a little bit more about Hermod, and some other messenger tasks that he did at Odin's request when we get to our next God, Vali. But first, we'll do that as soon as we grab a refill.
AMANDA: Let's do it.
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AMANDA: Hello, hello, and welcome everybody to the refill. I am so excited to be taking a bit of a vacation this week, so I am recording this a little bit early. And so if you have joined our Patreon in the last few days, know that we will be thanking you next week. But hey, did you know it is a great time to join our Patreon. Julia has just posted all of her special tarot draws for our top two tiers of patrons. There is both a group reading, to kind of set the vibe for a new season for all of us, and also custom readings for our legend-level patrons, who are by the way, Arianna, Audra, Bex, Chibi Yokai, Morgan, Morgan H., Sarah, and Bea Me Up Scotty. And supporting producers I hope you love your Tarot vibe check. Thank you, Uhleeseeuh, Anne, Brittany, Froody Chick, Hannah, Jack Marie, Jane, Kneazlekins, Lily, Matthew, Megan Moon, Nathan, Phil Fresh, Rikoelike, Captain Jonathan MAL-uh-kye Cosmos, Sarah, and Scott. Oh man, so much goodness for you enjoy. 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JULIA: Amanda, now that it's summertime, I have been in the mood for frozen cocktails. I love a frozen cocktail. They're not as strong as regular cocktails, but man, there's nothing better than what is basically amounts to a like alcoholic slushy in my mind.
AMANDA: Yeah. And when I'm already just constitutionally like red-faced and sweating from kind of like May to October, I'm okay with having a mild frozen drink.
JULIA: Yes, exactly. So this cocktail, the Midnight Sunshine is the perfect Nordic frozen drink. It's got Aqua Vit, which is a distilled spirit that's very popular in Nordic countries. I feel like it's kind of similar to gin in that it's got sort of like a botanical flavor to it. But the main flavor of aquavit is more like dill and fennel as opposed to like the Juniper kind of flavors of gin.
AMANDA: It's delicious, I've had it before.
JULIA: It's really good. And so this cocktail has frozen peaches, some honey thyme syrup, and some lemon juice to kind of like brighten the whole thing. So I think it's like perfect to sip on as we think a little bit more about the rest of the Norse gods.
AMANDA: Incredible.
JULIA: Let's get to it. I mentioned before Vali. And if that name sounds familiar, that's because there is a Vali who is one of the sons of Loki who I mentioned in the Loki episode. Who is killed by his other son Narfi. And then the entrails of Vali were used to bind Loki in his cave, which is a little bit of a bummer, I'm not gonna lie.
AMANDA: It is, still is.
JULIA: However, this is a different Vali. This is the youngest son of Odin by Rinda, who is either a goddess or a giant test depending on the source. So Vali is supposed to be the personification of the light days that grow longer as spring approaches, which is kind of beautiful. I think that's a really beautiful personification for a God, definitely.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: He's also depicted as the kind of rays of light coming off of the sun and those are often also depicted as arrows. So he's usually portrayed as an archer of some kind.
AMANDA: I’m gotta say Julia, among the hottest professions in war.
JULIA: I would say that as well and like you know, least likely to die because you're far away from the action.
AMANDA: That's true.
JULIA: Very important the stuff that you're doing though, and just upper arms, you know?
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: It’s just woo, upper arms. Vali plays an important role in once again one of the most important stories in Norse mythology, which is Amanda?
AMANDA: Death of Baldur.
JULIA: Death of Baldur. As you might remember Baldur was killed when Loki trick Hoder, who was Baldur's blind brother into killing Baldur by hurling a spear of mistletoe at him. Now, before all of this, Frigga had had that vision of Baldur's death and so she and Odin set out to try to prevent it from happening.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: One of the ways that Odin went about doing this, was going to the underworld to seek information on how to rescue Baldur. And while he was there, he was told that Baldur would be avenged by another one of his sons, one that hadn't been born yet. Which is like huh, reveal. You know I'm gonna have another son, he's going to avenge my other son, wild. What's going on here?
AMANDA: Damn.
JULIA: This son which would be Vali was prophesized to slay Hoder when he was only one day old. With his hands still unwashed and his hair uncombed. Which I love that image of like this is how you know this is a child, his hair is still uncombed, his hands are unwashed. That's how you know the difference between a man and a boy.
AMANDA: Yeah. Or I was even picturing like a baby fresh out of the womb.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: You know? And the first thing you do is—is you wash the baby. So that's like, oh, damn, that— that really is fresh.
JULIA: That's also probably accurate, so.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: I find it different interpretations—
AMANDA: Both—both are good.
JULIA: Both are good, both are good. So to find out more about this prophecy that's happening here, Odin sent our hot messenger Hermod to find out more from a wizard named [30:54]. So he gave Hermod his steed Sleipnir for the long perilous journey because we love a long perilous journey and we have to send the messenger.
AMANDA: Am I picturing me in Stardew Valley riding my horse named Apples over to the wizard's tower? Yes, I have.
JULIA: There's a wizard in Stardew Va—I've never played Stardew Valley, so I don't know anything about it.
AMANDA: Sure is.
JULIA: I just thought it was kind of like a chill farming game like, almost that Horizon Zero Dawn that's not a— that's not a farming game. I thought it was like what's the—
AMANDA: Harvest Moon.
JULIA: —even Harvest Moon. I—they're all lumped together, Amanda. The island one that everyone was playing during—
AMANDA: Animal Crossing.
JULIA: —during quarantine. Animal Crossing, that one.
AMANDA: No. Stardew has a little bit more plot and there is a little bit of like combat stuff you can get into.
JULIA: Ohhh.
AMANDA: But the— the wizard, don't worry about it. His ex-wife is the witch who lives in the bog under everyone's house.
JULIA: What's happening?
AMANDA: And don't worry, he's friends with all the Junimos who harvest your crops while you sleep.
JULIA: Oh, okay.
AMANDA: Don't worry about it.
JULIA: One day you'll have to tell me about the lore of Stardew Valley, because I'm so confused right now, but we'll allow it.
AMANDA: That sounds great, that sounds great.
JULIA: So eventually, Hermod reaches this wizard, but the wizard is not forthcoming with any information. So Hermod ties him up until he promises to help.
AMANDA: Great.
JULIA: [32:09] begins to cast a spell, Chanting as the sky first grew dark and then read in into a vision of blood, the blood of Baldur, Amanda.
AMANDA: Oh no.
JULIA: But from those blood-red skies, emerged an image of a beautiful woman with a child in her arms. Suddenly the child left from the woman's arms and the moment he touched the ground began to grow into a man. He shot an arrow and then suddenly the vision disappeared.
AMANDA: A real reverse Benjamin Button situation, aka aging.
JULIA: So the wizard tells Hermod that this woman that he saw on the image is Rinda who's a Jotunn. Hermod returns to Odin tells him of this vision and what's up. Odin then disguised himself as an ordinary man and set off to find and win the love of Rinda. Eventually he kind of like uses his magic to win her over, not necessarily in like a gross manipulative way, just like being like look how cool I am kind of way.
AMANDA: Hey, I can make this card go from here to here. Let's make babies.
JULIA: You know what the hottest thing in the world is? A magician.
AMANDA: That I'm not going to endorse.
JULIA: So Rinda agrees to marry him. Nine months later, Vali is born, and when he could walk he crossed over the Bifrost and into Asgard. When he appeared to the gods, he grew in front of their eyes until he was a full-grown man. And then he drew an arrow shooting Hodur who died instantly and the prophecy was fulfilled.
AMANDA: Oh my god.
JULIA: Vali in shooting Hodur, avenge Baldur's death and would become one of the few gods to actually survive Ragnarok and would see the return of both Hodur and Baldur from the dead.
AMANDA: Dang.
JULIA: And we'll talk a little bit more about that when we get to our Ragnarok episode, but—
AMANDA: Wooo. Have we done it already?
JULIA: Mmm, who can say? It's all cyclical baby. But that is Vali, Amanda. What do you think for Vali an epithet?
AMANDA: Oh, man. I think you're gonna have to go with Vali the Valiant, right?
JULIA: Yep. Or what's the— what's a good V-word for like grew very quickly.
AMANDA: Verdant would be—
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: —green, but like you know lush. Let's see, V adjectives. Okay, so we have like valiant already of course. We have vital or vivid.
JULIA: I think Vital is interesting because he does kind of fulfill an important prophecy.
AMANDA: Yeah, let's do it.
JULIA: Yeah, yeah.
AMANDA: Both important but also like full of life which—
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: You know, definitely is true, when he pops out the womb and shoots a god.
JULIA: Yeah. I also—I realized we didn't pick one for Hermod either.
AMANDA: Yes. Hermod I have on my list.
JULIA: Is it just Hermod the hot because he's the hot messenger god?
AMANDA: I think that's fine giving him enough credit.
JULIA: Okay, fair enough.
AMANDA: How about hospitable?
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: Because welcoming in the—the dead.
JULIA: Mmm, mmm, that's a good one.
AMANDA: Heroic, huggy.
JULIA: Huggy?!
AMANDA: Alright, I'm done with this shit.
JULIA: Alright, adjectives.com or whatever the fuck this is.
AMANDA: Hermod the hot, that's it.
JULIA: Yeah, I'm sorry.
AMANDA: Hermod the hot. Sorry, Hermod.
JULIA: He—he's just hot.
AMANDA: Hermod the hot.
JULIA: Alright, Amanda. Another important figure to the gods, but lacking in stories of her own is the goddess Idun. So she was married to Bragi, another god with not a lot of stories about him. Who is the god of poetry, eloquence, and music. It is said that he plays the harp and sings so sweetly that even the trees and flowers are charmed. So a real Orpheus kind of vibe from— from Bragi. Idun herself is the provider of the golden apples that gave the Aesir eternal use.
AMANDA: Important job.
JULIA: Very important job. In the Prose Edda, there is a story where Loki gets himself in trouble with the Jotunn Thiazi, who you might remember. Who demands in order to release Loki, Idun, and her golden apples.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: Loki rather than asking her to play along, tricks her and delivers her to Thiazi. And without her apples, the gods began to grow old and weak. So looking for the cause of Idun's disappearance, they of course turned to Loki and sent him back to get her. He does this of course, as we mentioned before by borrowing Freya's cloak turning into a falcon, and then finding Idun transforming her into a nut, and carried her back to Asgard where Thiazi who is pursuing him is killed. So Idun then gives the gods her apples and they are revived back to their youthful selves. That's really the only story we have about her, but like it really plays on how important her apples were to the gods being but Gods in this sense. What do we think in for Idun? It starts with an I for— for the listeners.
AMANDA: Oh, man. Okay, so there's the important. Okay, how about Idun the like, important, there's like immaculate. Like—
JULIA: Ohh, I kind of like that.
AMANDA: Close, right? Like close to, like, im— basically like the Immaculate Virgin or something like that—that's not what I'm going for. But—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: I'm thinking more like, you know, really crucial.
JULIA: Yeah, no, I—I like that. I think immaculate it's nice for her. She definitely doesn't get like one like intrepid or anything like that, because she just like I brought these apples and everyone loves them.
AMANDA: Yeah, right.
JULIA: And people want to marry me because I got these sick apples.
AMANDA: Yeah, right.
JULIA: In terms of important gods with fewer stories, there's also the sea god, Njord. So he was associated with wealth, fertility, the sea, and seafaring to the point where there is a saying that the wealthy were quote, as rich as Njord.
AMANDA: Oh, really?
JULIA: Yes. So he is one of the principal gods of the Vanir but was made an honorary member of the Aesir, following the Aesir-Vanir war which we've talked about before. Notably, he is the father of Freyr and Freya. And one of the stories that features Njord prominently is the marriage of Njord and Skadi. So as you might remember, it was we just talked about. Thiazi was killed while pursuing Loki, and Skadi, his daughter came seeking restitution for his death. You might remember that part of this was like, one of you has to make me laugh. And then there was a whole thing with Loki and his balls. So another part of the settlement was they agreed that Skadi could have any of the gods that she desired as her husband, but she had to select him by the sight of his legs and feet alone.
AMANDA: Julia, why do they come up with this shit?
JULIA: I don't know Amanda. They're just like, okay, you can't just like have your pick of the gods. You got to pick them by how hot their feet is. And this is where the Wiki feet came from.
AMANDA: Yeah, right. Seriously.
JULIA: This is the origins of the foot fetish.
AMANDA: Oh my god.
JULIA: So Skadi chose the fairest legs that she could see, thinking that they would be Baldur's. Because again, Baldur is perfect and beautiful, and every aspect of him would be hot right? However, it turns out to be Njord.
AMANDA: Njord the nasty. [30:03] those nasty feet. (appreciate it).
JULIA: So unsurprisingly, their marriage was not very long-lasting.
AMANDA: No. You're telling me Julia that I shouldn't pick a—pick a spouse on Wiki feet?
JULIA: No, I wouldn't recommend it, that wouldn't be the way that–
AMANDA: Shit. Oh, well.
JULIA: Though imagine the vows at that wedding.
AMANDA: Intense.
JULIA: The problem for them was not Njord's nasty or not nasty feet, but rather, they just didn't like each other's vibes. So half of their time was spent in Skadi's Snowy Mountains, which Njord hated. And then the other half of their time was spent in Njord’s hall, Noatun, or the place of sheeps, which Skadi hated. So after 18 days, nine days in each of their homes, they parted ways. They're just like, you know what, this isn't working out. We'll just get divorced, it's fine.
AMANDA: I mean, I guess power to you for making the choice.
JULIA: Exactly. Despite this being one of the few surviving stories featuring Njord's, scholars do actually believe that there's evidence that Njord is one of the most widely worshipped Gods among the Norse people. Particularly because seafaring was so important to Norse culture.
AMANDA: That makes sense to me.
JULIA: Yeah. And so despite the fact that Njord just like isn't in a lot of stories, like the fact that he's like, so wealthy and so like playing such an important role to everyday life for the Norse people, it's kind of unsurprising that they were like, yeah, Njord, we like that guy.
AMANDA: I get it. I get it.
JULIA: So are we going with Njord the nasty for him?
AMANDA: No, no, no.
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: That's unfair to him. I think we can go with not worthy.
JULIA: Mmm.
AMANDA: Okay. Maybe there is like nautical, of course. Maybe a little too on the nose.
JULIA: Maybe.
AMANDA: We have Nobel.
JULIA: Mmm. I know, there's not a lot of it. This game is hard when you don't have a ton of information about them, so—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: He's like, nimble doesn't really work. Though he apparently had very delicate and beautiful feet and legs, so maybe he was nimble. Who can say?
AMANDA: Yeah. I mean, it wasn't I think, maybe yeah, nouveau. There's novel, maybe like—
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: You know, one of his kind, and also, apparently, the nicest feet of the gods, so.
JULIA: Yeah, there you go, there you go. We'll go for it. I'm—I'm down for whatever.
AMANDA: Njord the Nobel.
JULIA: Alright. And then speaking of the wintry mountains that Skadi loves, we should talk about our final God for this episode, Ullr, who was the god of winter, skiers, hunting, the bow and shield, and snow shoes.
AMANDA: Among humankind's most wild inventions.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: Who—who knew those things would work?
JULIA: But made sense for the fact that like a lot of the Nordic countries spend a lot of time in the snow.
AMANDA: Oh, yeah.
JULIA: So you have to have a way of traversing that snow in a— in a way that isn't going to like absolutely destroy your body.
AMANDA: Makes total sense for Arctic-dwelling people. But I remember seeing them as a kid and being like, wait, what? What is snowshoeing? Wait, these?! Like I just— I could not conceive of it.
JULIA: Ullr is the son of the goddess Sif, the golden-haired wife of Thor that we've talked about before. Who is the goddess of grain and fertility and is also Thor's stepson, which I think is Thor is a stepdad is not something I ever considered until like doing the research for this and I was like, huh.
AMANDA: I think he'd be a great stepdad.
JULIA: I hope so, you know? Like stepdads tend to get a bad rep but I hope Thor is a good stepdad.
AMANDA: Listen, my mother-in-law's husband, so not quite the same thing. But my you know— my— my stepdad as I call him is fabulous, doesn't say much, two big dogs, nice garden and keep sugar in the house, which you know, otherwise it would not be. And I—I love that man dearly. I have a huge place for him in my heart and so I can imagine that Thor is just kind of like you know, a an older brother that—ish, where we're not quite the same maybe, but I think the best version of Thor would be a great stepdad.
JULIA: Thor has big barbecue stepdad energy, and I don't know—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —how else to describe it.
AMANDA: Exactly. No, you stand side by side and he goes, is everything alright? And you go I guess? And then he goes okay.
JULIA: Alright. Cool.
AMANDA: And just you know, he gives a little—little pat on the back.
JULIA: Yeah. He's never gonna like legally adopt you, but he'll be there for you.
AMANDA: He'll be there for you.
JULIA: So Ullr lives in the land of Ydalir, which translates to the Yew Dales, which I think is beautiful. Like imagine just a land full of like Yew trees.
AMANDA: Amazing.
JULIA: Gorgeous, majestic. This is another god that is spoken little of in the Edda's. But scholar suggests that there is evidence that he was extremely widely worshipped. He and Skadi are often portrayed together as hunting on skis and are associated with this method of transport. In some instances, having been the ones to invent it.
AMANDA: Dang.
JULIA: They invented skiing.
AMANDA: Huge deal.
JULIA: Which is incredible. For me, I wasn't a ski kid. I wasn't a snowboard kid. I don't really like winter sports, that's not my thing. So I kind of like in my mind pictured them as a more modern invention. Like I would have been like, yeah, I can help people probably invented skiing as like a pleasure sport in like the 1800s, right? No fucking ancient, basically.
AMANDA: That I did know.
JULIA: Yeah. Well, amazing. New for me, at least.
AMANDA: Very cool.
JULIA: There are also some Danish stories about like, Ullr being a magician who traveled over the sea on a magic bone.
AMANDA: Whoa!
JULIA: Which Archaeologists suggests might have been a reference to early ice skates who had blades made of bone.
AMANDA: This is— this is like a one-man triathlon over here of inventing important winter sports.
JULIA: If someone told me that Ullr invented the Winter Olympics, I would believe them. That's where I'm at right now.
AMANDA: Pretty incredible.
JULIA: And I just like I wanted to end on this one because I think he's so much fun. That's like the alll the information we have about him is just like that's the winter ports guy. And you're like, great, he seems awesome.
AMANDA: That's amazing. Yeah, like are we going with just like useful here, because like there's—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: —there's a lot there.
JULIA: Or unique was another one that I thought was kind of fun.
AMANDA: Unique is good. I think like creative writing workshops have like beaten out of me, they use of the word unique.
JULIA: Yeah, that's fair.
AMANDA: Unique, useful. How about Ullr the underrated?
JULIA: Oh, yeah, I like that. Because like, all these other gods or gods or like, war, and messengers and sunshine and stuff like that. And like, Ullr just out here like having a great time, loving the mountains, figuring out ways to like, have people traverse the mountains, making their livelihoods and like, you know, sustainable food and what not during the winter time when that's very hard to do. He's just out there, like making life a little bit easier for people. And I appreciate that.
AMANDA: And fun. I mean, go weee!
JULIA: You can go wee! And then shoot a deer.
AMANDA: Yeah, incredible.
JULIA: So that is our roundup. And as I mentioned before, if you're wondering, hey, Julia, what about this figure? Or what about this other one? Don't worry, we've got an entire other episode that's going to be touching on some of the other non-Vanir and Aesir figures that feature prominently in Norse mythology. So there's definitely a chance that one of your faves will be mentioned next time we returned to It's Norse Of Course.
AMANDA: I am so excited, Julia. But first, I do have to just pull you over into this vestibule. Just to go through which of the Applebee's appetizer combo some of these guys are going to be.
JULIA: Thank you, Amanda I had almost forgotten.
AMANDA: You're welcome. So I'm going to go ahead and read out to you different parts of the appetizer combo.
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: And I'm going to lean on you because you do know these people very well to sort of assign them.
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: So let's give you an overview. We have of course, boneless wings, spinach and artichoke dip, chicken quesadilla, and mozzarella sticks. There are also a number of dipping sauces and garnishes.
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: So who do we think just really screams boneless wings to us?
JULIA: I think Tyr for me is gonna be the boneless wings.
AMANDA: Yep.
JULIA: And that's not just a joke about his missing arm.
AMANDA: Yeah, you wouldn't ever do that.
JULIA: I would never do that. But I think that one you can get them kind of like barbecue or Buffalo if I remember correctly—
AMANDA: That's right.
JULIA: —from the been about a decade since I've been to an Applebee's kind of vibes.
AMANDA: Yep.
JULIA: And I just think that like kind of versatility, like maybe you're expecting one thing but you get another.
AMANDA: It's good.
JULIA: For Tyr works best for me.
AMANDA: Yeah. You know what, they're also going to come through for you. You are never going to get a boneless wing at a chain restaurant and be disappointed.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: In my opinion, it's gonna be exactly what it is. Okay, great. So next we have the spinach dip, but also the chips. So we have the spinach dip, but also I think the chips are important here.
JULIA: Okay. So for the spinach dip, would it be ironic if it is Ullr?
AMANDA: No, I think it would be great.
JULIA: No. Okay, great. Wonderful. I think it's Ullr, I think it's like the— you would think it's underrated because it's like just a little dip as opposed to like all these fried things, but then you're like—
AMANDA: That's right.
JULIA: —oh, wait, no, this is delicious and like very important to society as a whole.
AMANDA: The best thing on the menu. Yep.
JULIA: Yeah, yep, yep, yep.
AMANDA: Exactly right. And who screams probably mass-produced tortilla chip to us here?
JULIA: I'm thinking it's Vali for this one.
AMANDA: Okay. Good.
JULIA: Because a lot is riding on his shoulders as a God—
AMANDA: Yes!
JULIA: —who is like basically born to fulfill a prophecy. He does like one job and—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: You know, has to hold up the like vengeance for Baldur.
AMANDA: And the weight of that cheesy, cheesy dip.
JULIA: Yeah, I think it's gotta be that.
AMANDA: Incredible. How about the chicken quesadilla?
JULIA: The chicken quesadilla, is it Heimdall, the chicken quesadilla?
AMANDA: Oh, interesting.
JULIA: Or is it Njord?
AMANDA: Ah, you know what I think I'm gonna argue for Njord as mozzarella sticks, which is our last thing on the menu here.
JULIA: Interesting.
AMANDA: Just because just lots like anxiousness can't really get through a lot of them and comes with a sauce pairing.
JULIA: Well, that's a matter of opinion.
AMANDA: That's true.
JULIA: I could get through a lot of mozzarella sticks.
AMANDA: I saw meal yesterday that was like oh four cheese sticks too many, four cheese sticks, deep rinds are a marinara sauce as a pre-meal to my dinner—
JULIA: Give me 12!
AMANDA: —give it to me, yeah. It seems to me like like Njord would come with his own dipping sauce.
JULIA: Yes. And he's anxious and like, if you looked at a mozzarella stick that was like peeled apart you'd be like wow, that's a sexy leg.
AMANDA: It would be a sexy leg, exactly.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: So anyway, that leads me to believe. I was actually thinking Idun for the— for the chicken quesadilla.
JULIA: Oh interesting.
AMANDA: Just like immaculate, all packaged up, nice and dunkable. I don't know, pleasing shape?
JULIA: Yeah, I think that's good, that's definitely good. I was thinking originally Heimdall because it's like so neatly wrapped and that's like Heimdall at the top of the Bifrost like making sure nothing— nothing comes your way.
AMANDA: Oh, hell yeah.
JULIA: I'm—I'm down to give it to either.
AMANDA: Let's um—let's— let's do a little swing here. Let's say that for some reason we got as well a side order of, oh, let's say breadsticks with Alfredo sauce. That sounds terrible or—
JULIA: No.
AMANDA: —white queso dip and chips. Not gonna go on Applebee's for. Brewpub pretzels and beer cheese.
JULIA: Now that I think is truly the Idun of the Applebee's menu. Because it's like, you know, it's probably something that isn't going to taste good. It's like Applebee's is trying to be higher end.
AMANDA: Yeah, you're not a gastropub.
JULIA: And that's like what Thiazi was looking for in getting Idun and her golden apples was like, I want to be as cool and as hot and as useful as the Aesir and the Vanir. So I'm going to try to order the brewpub, the brew cheese and pretzel dip, and or whatever the fuck this is.
AMANDA: Uh huh, exactly. Alright, Julia we've— we've done well here.
JULIA: Amanda, I think we did a good job here. You're right, this is fantastic.
AMANDA: I think so too. And I will come up with another wild sort of like combo round for the end of our next installment of It's Norse Of Course.
JULIA: Fantastic. And Amanda as you are ordering a sampling platter of the different gods and goddesses of Norse mythology. Remember, stay creepy.
AMANDA: Stay cool.
[theme]
AMANDA: Spirits was created by Amanda McLoughlin, Julia Schifini, and Eric Schneider with music by Kevin MacLeod and visual design by Alison Wakeman.
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JULIA: Thanks for listening to Spirits. We'll see you next week.
AMANDA: Bye!