Episode 233: Sinbad the Sailor
/An episode with a framing device, within a framing device. We’re getting meta here with the One Thousand and One Nights story, Sinbad the Sailor. We discuss whether or not Sinbad is the luckiest or unluckiest guy in the world, his buckwild plans, and befriending eccentric rich guys.
Content Warning: This episode contains conversations about or mentions of xenophobia, death, drowning, infidelity, misogyny, wealth disparity, peril, starvation, cannibalism, and violence.
Housekeeping
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Transcript
Amanda: Welcome to Spirits Podcast, a boozy dive into mythology, legends, and folklore. Every week, we pour a drink and learn about a new story from around the world. I'm Amanda and my cohost, Julia, is on a much deserved break. And this is Episode 233: Sinbad the Sailor. This is a good one. There are frame narratives in frame narratives. There is a story with unpredictable twists and turns to someone like me who has never heard the story before and something that has influenced a lot of pop culture. And that's always one of my favorite things to talk about here on Spirits. So, I think you're all gonna really enjoy it. I would love to thank the people who joined our Patreon over the last week; Afternoon Star, Alex B, Joe Vito, Chingaling21. Thank you so, so very much for prioritizing supporting independent creators in your budget. It means a lot. Thanks too to our supporting producer level patrons; Uhleeseeuh, Allison, Bryan, Debra, Hannah, Jane, Jessica Kinser, Jessica Stewart, Justin, Keegan, Kneazlekins, Liz, Megan Linger, Megan Moon, Phil Fresh, Polly, Captain Jonathan MAL-uh-kye Cosmos, Sarah, Scott, Skyla, and Zazi, and those legend level patrons; Audra, Chimera or Change, Clara, Drew, Jack Marie, Jaybaybay, Ki, Lada, Morgan, Necroroyalty, Taylor, & Bea Me Up Scotty. We love preparing our Patreon rewards for you like recipe cards that you can get for every single episode with an alcoholic and non-alcoholic version, the Episode Notes where we listen back to our buzzed recording and give you links and comments and sort of behind-the-scenes look at how the episode was made, and many other things; including even physical packages, care packages of fun stuff that we send right to you. If you'd like to join, the link for that is patreon.com/spiritspodcast. And, listen, I think I have talked in sort of passing about how much I love food TV shows. I know I've talked about Guy Fieri and Guy's Grocery Games, but this season of Top Chef is the best season ever. We're only I think five episodes in and it is already a season that I know I'm gonna be re-watching for years to come. It is filmed over COVID times last October of 2020. And you can tell that everybody there; the judges, the cast, the people that they meet in Portland where it's taking place, are just so happy to be talking to people and like to be in a room with other folks. And, like, they know how unlikely and, like, difficult it is to make this actually happen that it is just such a pleasure to watch a reality competition show where, like, it's all the pluses, you know, of having a competition show, but no one is mean to each other. And there are, like, very few of those kind of reality TV plotlines where it's like, “Oh, this person like this person's dish and like a too cold oven.” None of that. Like, the contestants help each other and love each other. And they have, like, witty banter in between the different parts of the competition. And just like the editing is so tight because they're all so charismatic and excited to be there. It is so good. And, if you've never watched Top Chef or you’re kind of like, “Padma Lakshmi. Like, I, I know she's around. Like, what is that show about?” It's a really good one to get into. So, my recommendation this week, Top Chef. And, if you are out and about and can't be watching Top Chef at the moment, what you can be doing is listening to another show in the Multitude Collective. We're an independent podcast collective. Meaning that all the shows are owned by their hosts. We all make our own individual money. We help each other do things like, you know, spread the word about the show and go to events when that becomes a thing again and share our studio and our resources with each other. And the sort of core of that is knowing that, if you like Spirits, you're probably gonna like the other shows in Multitude and vice versa. The thing that ties us all together is a sense of curiosity about the world around us and celebrating stuff we love while also being critical of that thing. And whether you want to learn more about science and world building in Exolore, if you want to take a tour through children's mysteries in Meddling Adults, with the Harry Potter books in Potterless, or you want to have a sort of story of modern superheroes unfold in front of you in Join the Party, learn about the culture of basketball in Horse, there are so many options for you, including, by the way, fully scripted and casted and sound design sitcom called Next Stop. So, tons to offer. Go to multitude.productions to check out all of our shows or search for Multitude in your podcast player. That will also become partner shows we work on like This is Good for You with Nicole Perkins and My 90s Playlist with Tracy Clayton and Akoto Ofori-Atta. So, listen, this story of Sinbad the Sailor has so much to offer. I'm gonna get out of the way and let you enjoy it. So, please, everybody enjoy Spirits Podcast Episode 233: Sinbad the Sailor.
Intro Music
Julia: I feel like we were really lucky, Amanda, because, when we were growing up, we had this kind of, like, animated movie Renaissance, right?
Amanda: Yeah, we did. I didn't even think that those kinds of movies were exceptional until they stopped being made. Or they're much rarer and, this time, made by, you know, Pixar and, and company. So, totally, we totally grew up exactly in the Disney, you know, cartoon feature 90s phase.
Julia: Yeah, I mean Disney, at the time, was putting out movies like The Lion King, and Mulan, and Aladdin, and Pocahontas. But it wasn't just Disney either. Like, DreamWorks was out there putting out really incredible stuff too like Prince of Egypt, obviously, a classic. The Road to El Dorado was one of my favorites.
Amanda: Hmm.
Julia: I used to watch it. I, like, ran that VHS to the bone.
Amanda: Oh, yeah.
Julia: I broke it, I think. I watched it so many times. But what I want to talk about today is one that I feel, like, kind of gets overlooked in this sort of oeuvre of 90s and early 2000 films. And that is Sinbad, Legend of the Seven Seas. We're, obviously, not going to spend a lot of time talking about Brad Pitt, and Catherine Zeta Jones, and Michelle Pfeiffer, as the goddess Eris, for some reason.
Amanda: Oh, my.
Julia: Because, like, why is there a Greek goddess in a Arab story? Who knows? I don't know. She is extremely hot though in that movie. Like, from, for an animated hot lady villain perspective, extremely hot.
Amanda: Oh, yeah.
Julia: But, instead, we are going to talk about the story that inspired the film, which is the story of Sinbad the Sailor. Hey, what's up?
Amanda: I love it. It's, it's a nice day outside. We're getting into summertime, for us. We have boats to look at longingly from the shore, for me. And I'm ready for it.
Julia: All right. Great. So, to get us started with Sinbad the Sailor, we should talk about One Thousand and One Nights, which our Western listeners might know by its other name which is Arabian Nights. In case you haven't heard of One Thousand and One Nights, it is a collection of Middle Eastern tales collected from various authors, translators, and scholars from, like, all over Western, Central, and Southern Asia as well as North Africa. So, the origins and history of the Nights is pretty tangled and, like anything with a complex history, is hotly debated among historians.
Amanda: I love a hot debate among historian.
Julia: I know. There's so many when it comes to the Nights. There's so many. I wish I could just do a full episode on, like, here's what historians are fighting about this time with One Thousand and One Nights—
Amanda: [Chuckles]
Julia: —but not the time or the place. One of the prototypes that might have inspired One Thousand and One Nights, as we know it, is a Persian book, which is called The Thousand Stories. And that ties itself to the Nights that we know mainly because of the framing device that it uses, which we'll touch upon in a moment. But, despite its name, however, the Persian, The Thousand Stories only features about 200.
Amanda: Oh, no. That's a failure of marketing. Unless – is it like a sampling of The Thousand Stories that were told?
Julia: Perhaps. Who can say? I believe it's an incomplete fragment. And, so, therefore, we don't know exactly how many stories. But, like, the amount that we have is about 200.
Amanda: That makes more sense.
Julia: The earliest fragment of what we know to be the book of the tale of The Thousand Nights, according to the scholar, Nabia Abbott, actually dates back to the ninth century.
Amanda: Oh, god.
Julia: So, that's the earliest one, but it's like literally only 16 lines. That's all we have.
Amanda: I mean we have much less of, like, [Inaudible 3:34 – escolas] and some other writers from even further back.
Julia: You're not wrong. But, like, the fact that we know it's there and the fact that we can probably date it to somewhere in the ninth century, very cool.
Amanda: That is very cool.
Julia: The first reference to the collection with its most common name, The Thousand and One Nights appears to have come from Cairo in the 12th century. And then the first printed Arabic language edition of One Thousand and One Nights was published in 1775. And, while no copies of that version actually remain, it was the basis of a later edition that was published by the Egyptian government in 1835.
Amanda: Cool.
Julia: So, it's not, like, the exact addition but it is the basis of one that we obviously have copies of still. However, the first European translation which is in French and translated by Antoine Galland was published starting in 1704 and released the final 12th volume in 1717.
Amanda: That is much earlier than I would have guessed.
Julia: And is even, like, much older than the actual, like, Arabic language version that was published later by a good, like, 60 years.
Amanda: Pretty impressive.
Julia: Yeah. Yeah. Kind of sad, though. You would think that the Arabic language one probably should have come out first and not the French one, but here we are.
Amanda: Was there an addition in, like, Farsi or something? Or was it just, like, not bound and published in that form until that time?
Julia: It was just not bound and published in that form until that time.
Amanda: Cool.
Julia: So, Antoine Galland published those versions, became extremely popularized, released 12 volumes. And it was based on this Syrian Medieval Arabic manuscript as well as these oral tales that were relayed to Galland by these men from Aleppo, whose name was Hanna Diyab. And Hanna Diyab kind of was like, “Hey, here's stories that I have heard from, like, when I was growing up and you can include them in your book.” And he was like, “Great. Awesome.” Hopefully, he was compensated properly.
Amanda: I was just going to say I bet there was not a royalty split when there should have been. So, you know, just want to – just want to put that out there.
Julia: Probably not. A quick side note on the manuscript that Galland used for his translation because, again, it's one of those things that scholars kind of are hotly debating. Interestingly, the dating for this manuscript is contested because of all things. The types of coins that are mentioned in the text does not really compare to real life coin issues from time periods.
Amanda: Oh, fuck yeah, dude.
Julia: So, I don't know the exact details. But, god, I kind of love this stuff because it gets scholars to just start writing these really fun passive-aggressive papers about how their colleagues are wrong. Because, obviously, this fake coin is a reference to this real coin and not that real coin, David.
Amanda: Extremely good. I bet historians miss that part of conferences and scientists too. Really lots of different disciplines where, in the [Inaudible 6:26], you can have a very specific sort of, like, back and forth about an extremely obscure, to me, topic.
Julia: I love being kind of a, a generalist when it comes to things. But to be a historian or a scientist who is, like, very specifically into a specific issue just seems really cool and like the dream, you know.
Amanda: It does. I think there's a bit of grass is greener, you know, syndrome going on. But that, that sounds so cool probably.
Julia: For the record, this Syrian manuscript, again, is not a complete manuscript, hence, why Galland had to supplement his translation with the stories from Diyab. So, because we know that One Thousand and One Nights was never really, like, a single work, but rather a collection of works compiled together, what ties these together?
Amanda: What does?
Julia: As I mentioned before, Amanda, One Thousand and One Nights has a framing device. I love framing devices. Sounds good.
Amanda: Julia, we love a framing device.
Julia: We do.
Amanda: I love framing devices. I love it. It is like the single best takeaway from doing an English degree. It’s an appreciation even more so than before about framing devices and meta text, which is, like, the stuff that wraps around a story like the book, and the binding, and all that kind of good stuff.
Julia: Yeah. This framing device that One Thousand and One Nights uses has been around since at least that early Persian manuscripts, The Thousand Stories. The framing device probably deserves an episode all on its own, but I will give the shortened version here. And maybe we'll revisit it at some point because I really like it. So, this is the story of Scheherazade. So, once, long ago, there was a Persian king whose name was Shahryār, who was married but discovered that his first wife was being unfaithful to him. So, he decided, rather than remarry and allow himself to be cuckolded like that again, unacceptable, he would marry a new woman every day and have her beheaded the next morning so that she wouldn't have the opportunity to dishonor him that way, which is like big yikes.
Amanda: I think I'm gonna hop into JSTOR and sort of see what scholars have to say about this because that is just such an escalation. And I wonder if it's dramatic escalation, if it's, like, you know, supposed to be a bit of a farce or an exaggeration, or if there's any kind of precedent because like – what the fuck?
Julia: I do know that I haven't read a lot of translations of One Thousand and One Nights. I have read one, maybe two. But I do know that it is well known for being raunchy at times in a fun way.
Amanda: [Chuckles]
Julia: In a fun storytelling way. And, so, I would not be surprised if this was supposed to be, like, somewhat comedic in the sense that like, “Oh, yeah, that was a big kind of overreaction by that dude.”
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: He makes his bloody way through all of the woman with noble blood in his kingdom. And then, finally, he's like, “Well, who am I going to marry next?” And the vizier, the kind of, like, political—
Amanda: Uh-huh, Julia, I listened to Wicked. I know what a vizier is.
Julia: Or you've seen the movie, Aladdin. You know what's up. This guy, not evil, though. So, he offers up his own daughter, Scheherazade as the next bride. In some versions, it's like Scheherazade is like, “Hey, Dad, I got this.
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: I'm gonna volunteer.” And he's like, “No, please don't.” And she's like, “No, I got this.” But here is a great description of Scheherazade from Sir Richard Burton's English translation of the Nights. Scheherazade has perused the books, the annals, the legends of proceeding kings, and the stories, examples, and instances of bygone men and things. Indeed, it was said that she had collected a thousand books of histories relating to antique races and departed rulers. She had perused the works of the poets and knew them by heart. She had studied philosophy and the sciences, arts, and accomplishments. And she was pleasant and polite, wise and witty, well read and well bred.
Amanda: She would have been a great cohost of Spirits.
Julia: She would have been. You can replace me with her. It's fine. I'm okay with that.
Amanda: Also, maybe we can alternate.
Julia: Okay.
Amanda: Or maybe we can have a, a third cohost on. It'll, it'll be fine.
Julia: All right. Great. But she sounds incredible, right? She's great.
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: So, she marries the king. And, when she is brought to his chamber, she asks that she be allowed to bid farewell to her sister who's like in on the conspiracy of, like, the plot that was going to happen here. So, the sister asked Scheherazade to tell a story and she does. And she tells this story that, like, is so engaging that it keeps the king awake and just, like, listening in awe. Then she stops in the middle of the story. And the king is like, “Wait. No. Hold on. You have to finish story.” And she's like, “I'd like to. I'm sorry. I can't. The sun is rising. And you promised that you would behead me before the next day.”
Amanda: [Laughs]
Julia: And the king is like, “Well, shit, okay. I really want to hear the end of the story, though. So, okay, I will spare your life for one more day so you can finish telling me the story tomorrow night.” The next night, she finishes the first story but starts telling a second story—
Amanda: That's it.
Julia: —even more exciting than the first one and then she stops again halfway through. And the king does the same thing so that she can finish her story.
Amanda: This is why I can't read WIPs, Julia. This is why, when I am going through archive of our own reading more fanfiction for White Collar or Suits or my favorite USA Network dramas from the late 2000s, I have to check the box for complete only because the experience of waiting for the next installment is too much for my little heart.
Julia: Well, luckily for Scheherazade, that, like, too much for the hardness is what keeps her alive.
Amanda: I love it.
Julia: So, the king keeps her alive day after day. And, at the end of a thousand and one nights and thousand stories, Scheherazade is like, “I'm sorry. I have no more tales to tell you.” But, at that point, the king is like very much in love with her and, like, can't even consider killing her. And, so, they stayed together.
Amanda: Incredible. And this, this is really quite a kind of romance novel trope as well. Or, rather, it shows the things I love about romance novels, which is where you start and you're like, “I know that, in the end, they're gonna get together. But how the fuck do they get there?”
Julia: How they got there?
Amanda: And, just knowing that it's sort of, like, an impossible situation that the author still finds a route through, it's like a locked room mystery, you know, where it's like, “I know there's a solution. I don't know what the hell it is.”
Julia: Yeah, I love that. And, Amanda, that's just the framing device. Sinbad is one of the stories that Scheherazade tells the king and is among one of the most famous of the stories that comes out of One Thousand and One Nights. Ironically, however, the Sinbad story itself also has a framing device.
Amanda: We love it.
Julia: Probably because the story predates the One Thousand and One Nights publication and stuff like that and existed as its own standalone story. So, obviously, they would have needed a framing device for it at its own time. But the story begins in Baghdad, specifically, around the reign of Harun al-Rashid, who’s a real person who ruled from 789 to 809.
Amanda: Wow.
Julia: The story kind of starts with this poor man who is known as Sinbad the Porter, who is walking the streets of Baghdad lamenting of his lowly status in society. He's like, “My feet are tired. I've carried people's stuff for my entire life. This blows.” So, he rests on a bench outside of a rich man's home. And, inside, he can, like, hear all of this music playing. He can hear people singing and laughing. Like, a breeze goes by and he can smell this delicious food and wine. He looks by and he sees the courtyard of the house with its beautiful trees and plants. And there's birds singing in the trees. And he just kind of exclaimed like, “Oh, this is unfair. All of this is unfair. Some people just have all the luck and all the fortune. And it's just not right.” However, someone inside hears him kind of lamenting out loud about his plight and invites him into the house to dine with him and the others. The man turns out to be the owner of the home. And it is quickly revealed that his name is also Sinbad. But he's not Sinbad the Porter, but, rather, Sinbad the Sailor.
Amanda: Interesting.
Julia: Who goes on to tell the man the story of his life and how he made his wealth.
Amanda: Oh, my goodness.
Julia: So, he kind of starts it off with this little poem that he recites for the porter. It's like supposed to be a poem that exists in real life, but it's not credited. So, I don't know who actually wrote it. He says, “By means of toil man shall scale the height; Who to fame aspires musn’t sleep o’night: Who seeketh pearl in the deep must dive, Winning weal and wealth by his main and might: And who seeketh Fame without toil and strife Th’ impossible seeketh and wasteth life,” which is very pretty but also a little bit too much, like, pull yourself up by your own bootstraps for my taste, especially since, fun fact, Sinbad did, in fact, inherit a lot of his wealth from his parents. But then he ended up spending it recklessly.
Amanda: Oh, my god. I, I – yes, my, my sort of, like, capitalistic, you know, like, social climbing, “can't you just try” alarms were totally going off there.
Julia: This poem does transition us into the Tales of Sinbad, His Seven Voyages.
Amanda: So, this is Sailor Sinbad sort of self-aggrandizement, you know, and, like, self-mythologizing to poor Sinbad, who probably is, like, getting a good meal and off his feet for, finally, an hour.
Julia: One hundred percent what's happening here. So, Sinbad is like, “I'm gonna tell you this story, have some wine, eat some food. It's gonna be great.”
Amanda: I also want to say this was totally my fantasy. When I was first out of college and living in, like, Upper Manhattan, I would walk down to the Upper East Side, which is a quite an affluent neighborhood and just sort of, like, linger outside of beautiful brownstones and sort of fantasize about, like, an old person being like, “Young lady, you look like you're up and coming and need a hand. Let me give you my brownstone.”
Julia: The true New York dream.
Amanda: Oh, yeah, like, anytime I give up a seat on a subway or hold open a door for somebody, I didn't need thanks. But I wouldn't have said no to, like, an inheritance. You know what I mean?
Julia: Yeah. You know, you want someone to be like, “My children are spoiled and don't deserve my money. You, you struggling artists, you should take my millions.”
Amanda: Yeah, to be clear, I’d love the relationship. I'd love to learn their wisdom, be their friend, hang out. Just saying, you know, it'll, it’ll be nice. It’ll be nice.
Julia: So, Sinbad’s first voyage took place after he had lost all that inherited money. And, so, he set off to become a merchant sailor in order to make ends meet. He found that sailing super appealed to him and began to become like a really popular merchant in the ports that he would visit and began to make some money. Great. You know, classic. However, as we all well know, the sea is a particularly perilous place. So, one day, he and his crew docked up against a small island that seemed to not have any other inhabitants. So, the sailors start making a fire to kind of cook themselves some food only to realize very quickly that they were not on an island at all, but, rather, on the back of an enormous whale.
Amanda: Oh, my god.
Julia: So, with a fire burning on its back, the whale dives deep into the ocean, which leaves Sinbad kind of drifting on a piece of wood while the rest of the ship flees from this angry whale.
Amanda: Also, getting real Pokemon Snap vibes in a very pleasant way.
Julia: Okay. Good. I'm glad. So, Sinbad is stranded and he remains floating in the sea until he luckily drifts on to the shores of an island. On that island, he is found by this horse groom, like a stable guy, who is trying to save a horse that is being, like, attacked by another powerful mythical seahorse.
Amanda: Ooh.
Julia: Not like a seahorse like the creature that we know, but a horse from the sea.
Amanda: Oh, my goodness.
Julia: So, working together, they managed to save this horse. The horse groom thanks Sinbad and reveals to Sinbad that he actually works for the king of the island who is named King Mihrjan. It's spelled differently from the mirage that we know of, but, like, not too far off. So, I'm not sure if it's like connected at all, but it seems cool.
Amanda: I think that’s a loan word that was just, you know, like, transliterated into English. So, I wouldn't be surprised.
Julia: Yeah, sweet. He takes Sinbad to go see King Mihrjan, who is very, very kind to Sinbad. He promises him, like, anything he needs as long as he's on the island. He's very grateful that he got his horse back. So, he's just being a real nice, good guy.
Amanda: Nice.
Julia: And, so, Sinbad is kind of loving this island life. He is spending a lot of time with other merchants and sailors on the island. He's making friends, going to parties and stuff. And then, one day, he's in the market and he sees a chest, like a sea chest, with his name on it. And he realizes that it's because the ship that left him to die is in the port.
Amanda: Oh, my.
Julia: And he's like, “Oh, shit.” So, he goes and he approaches the captain. And he's like, “Hey, it's me, Sinbad. Remember the whale?” And the captain is like, “I don't – what? You're supposed to be dead. No, you can't be Sinbad.” But, eventually, he manages to finally convince him like, “Yes, I'm Sinbad. Here's what happened.”
Amanda: It's me. Sinbad. You're probably wondering how I got here.
Julia: Almost exactly. So, now that he's found his ship, he wants to return home, obviously. He's like, “This island is really nice. But, you know, back, that's my home.” But he goes and he thanks the king for taking care of him while he was on the island. And he gives the king some of his belongings as gifts. So, like, the ones that he had left on the ship that, I guess, his fellow sailors hadn't sold for scrap or whatever. And the king is like, “Oh, since you're giving me gifts, let me give you some gifts.” And Sinbad kind of walks away with nicer gifts than he gave—
Amanda: Aww.
Julia: —which kind of gives him this idea. And, so, when he's returning back to Baghdad, in each port that they stopped in, Sinbad would trade the gifts that he was given for items of more value and then kept trading until he was incredibly wealthy by the time he arrived back home.
Amanda: Julia, it's the paper clip to a house thing.
Julia: Literally, in my notes, that's what I wrote.
Amanda: Yes. Oh, my god.
Julia: Explain what that is to people who don't know what we're talking about, please.
Amanda: I forgot the original medium. Was it just like a – like a web post? Like, just somebody like a blog or something?
Julia: I think it – I saw a video of, like, someone who's in one of those free or trading groups on Facebook that was like, “I'm gonna take this paperclip and get a car.”
Amanda: I think that person was on TikTok. But there was also a version of that, like, 15 years ago of somebody just on the internet talking about – yeah, like, you know, you just barter items each time and then, eventually, you start with – you know, that person started with a paperclip and then ended up with, you know, a house, a car, like some mythical gigantic item.
Julia: Yeah, but that's what he does. It's basically just that.
Amanda: Wow. I think it's also a really – a really useful reminder that, to get capital, you need capital. And there's no such thing as, as rags to riches.
Julia: That is true. Sinbad with your terrible pull up your bootstraps poem from before, no, no, no. So, we, at this point, return back to the framing device, the framing story. And Sinbad the Sailor is like, “So, yeah, Sinbad the Porter, take some money from me to help your family. And, when you come back tomorrow – if you want to come back tomorrow, I'll tell you more of my tales.” And the porter is like, “Wow. I've made a very cool eccentric rich guy for a friend. So, sure, I will absolutely come back.”
Amanda: I, sure, chose a good bench to have my breakdown on.
Julia: Mhmm. God, yeah, he did, huh?
Amanda: Haven’t we all? I know – I know well the benches that I've had my breakdowns on, Julia. I know exactly what table in Herald Square. I know what bench in Central Park West.
Julia: You know what? It's, it's one of those things where it's like, “If you haven't cried in public as a New Yorker at some point, then you're not really a New Yorker yet.”
Amanda: I know. And somebody walks by like, “You good?” I'm like, “I'm good.” And they're like, “Great.” And that's the ideal interaction I'd say that I would have with a stranger.
Julia: I was gonna say, like, I'm shocked someone asked if you were good.
Amanda: Oh, no. That – yeah, that, that totally happens. Like, seeing people fall, you know, or something like that. Like, you get a real – just, like, a bunch of gruff New Yorkers, like, pick you up, move you out of the way, say, “You good?” or just, like, wait. It's all done with a real sense of, like, embarrassment of like, “Don't call attention to this. I'm just like – I'm doing this. Like, let's just not focus on it.”
Julia: That's the true New Yorker thing. It’s like, “We are going to help you, but you cannot thank us.”
Amanda: Yes.
Julia: So, the next night, Sinbad the Porter is back at Sinbad the Sailor’s house to hear more about his journey. So, Sinbad the Sailor sits him down and tells him more just like I'm gonna tell you more, but, first, let’s get a refill.
Amanda: Meta text, hooray!
Midroll Music
Amanda: We are sponsored this week by Calm, which is a sponsor that I'm really happy to have the chance to talk to you all about every few weeks because it is so important to have, like, mental health check-ins with yourself. And I use my nightly Calm app as a way to just kind of check in with myself. Like, how am I feeling today? Am I anxious? How is my sleep going? Do I feel focused? Do I feel unfocused? Like, what's going on? And Calm app, whether you're using their meditations, their soundscapes of like lovely, like, rain, you know, or calming sounds around you, or listening to a sleep story as you drift off, building that time into your routine where all you're doing is just that little bit a kind of mental wellness for yourself is so important. Over 100 million people around the world including me use Calm take care of their minds. And whether you're trying to sleep more, stress less, just live better, calm is a great way to do it. So, for listeners of the show, Calm is offering a special limited time promotion of 40 percent off a Calm premium subscription at calm.com/spirits. For those of you who are not New Yorkers, that is C-A-L-M.C-O-M/spirits for 40 percent off unlimited access to Calm’s entire library, calm.com/spirits. It may not surprise any of you that me, tender-hearted inside kid with big feet – I'm a size 12 women's shoe. That’s a 10.5 men's shoe. Hard to find shoes in that size. But I also get blisters at the slightest – like, I tightened my shoe laces and I get blisters. And I was so delighted to learn that the shoes that Rothy’s sent to me did not give me blisters. I wore them sockless to do my laundry as a little just like, you know, outside the house let's go, you know, a few 100 feet and see how it goes. It was excellent. Went on a long walk around the neighborhood. Excellent. Gonna plan to wear it on a road trip where I don't even have the option of going back for a different pair of shoes because I like them that much. And I am so confident that they are comfy. They're stylish. There's some that go with a lot of different outfits. Rothy’s is great. And, no matter where you take your shoes, they are also machine washable. They're fully washable. You can like literally put them in the washing machine and they'll come out looking great. They're durable. They're flexible. And their thread is made from repurposed plastic water bottles, which I think is great. Upgrade your closet with washable, sustainable, stylish shoes and bags from Rothy’s. Plus, they just launched men's shoes. So, be sure to check them out for you or a guy in your life. Head to rothys.com/spirits to find your new favorites today. That's R-O-T-H-Y-S.com/spirits. I know that, as a person with generalized anxiety disorder, my brain is often kind of lost in thinking about what ifs and worrying about what's going on around me. And, when our new sponsor She's Birdie reached out to us, I thought that this would be a really great option for anyone who would feel a little bit safer and a little bit more secure and kind of take one of those worries off your mind by carrying around a personal safety alarm. She's Birdie, they're easy to carry and simple to use. And, when you activate them, it's like pulling, you know, a lock out of a padlock. Like, you kind of pull the top off really quickly. The alarm emits 130 decibels siren and has a flashing strobe light. So, if you ever need it – hopefully, you never do – just having that in your pocket if it will make you feel safer. I hope that this is an option that you check out. It is not dangerous. It is not illegal anywhere like pepper spray or whatever. It's something that you can feel competent to use without the worry if you ever need to. It is also very stylish, very millennial. They come in multiple colors. And they have a sturdy key chain. So, you can attach it to your keys, your bag, keep one in your backpack, one in your purse. It's just I think a good option to look for if it is something that will make you feel more secure and take one of those anxieties off of your mind. So, if that is of interest to you, right now, She's Birdie is offering our listeners 15 percent off your first purchase when you go to shesbirdie.com/spirits. Go to She’s Birdie. That spelled S-H-E-S-B-I-R-D-I-E.com/spirits for 15 percent off your first purchase, shesbirdie.com/spirits.
Julia: So, since we're sailing with Sinbad in this episode, I wanted a more nautical drink. And I was remembering a time where I was at this, like, beach side bar and they had a drink called Tomorrow We Sail, which I really liked.
Amanda: Ooh, I love that.
Julia: And I thought it was really fitting because not only is it a nautical inspired drink, but it also has that kind of similar promise to both of our framing devices. There will be more adventure tomorrow.
Amanda: Aww, I love that.
Julia: It's a little bit of champagne, a little bit of port wine, some dark rum, and then a splash of orange liqueur. I like Cointreau. Do whatever you'd like though. And then you'll get your sea legs in no time.
Amanda: Delish.
Julia: Delish. So, Sinbad’s second voyage, Sinbad is like, “Hmm. Yes, I'm now very rich. And that's great and all. But, being rich in just one place, kind of boring, to be honest.”
Amanda: Oh.
Julia: So, he misses the sea and decides to set sail again. He sets out with a crew and, once again, they find themselves docked in a seemingly uninhabited island.
Amanda: Can I guess what the problem is this time?
Julia: Go for it.
Amanda: Okay. Are the trees actually sentient?
Julia: No, but good guess.
Amanda: Are there mythical creatures that run them off?
Julia: You got it.
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: Well, kind of. You'll see. All right. Luckily, this time, Amanda, no whale. The sailors go out. They explore the island. Sinbad is loving this island. It's so nice. It’s so great.
Amanda: [Laughs]
Julia: And he's just like, “I'm just gonna, like, take a quick break.” And he just starts, like, napping in the sun.
Amanda: Great. Great.
Julia: Great. However, by the time he wakes up, he realizes that the crew has once again left him behind.
Amanda: God damn it, Sinbad.
Julia: They're just like, “We couldn't find him. So, I guess we got to go.”
Amanda: Oh, man.
Julia: So, stuck on this island, Sinbad decides to explore it a little bit more. He's like, “Maybe I'll find my way off if I just kind of look around a bit.” He discovers this massive white orb and then quickly realizes that it's not an orb at all, but, instead, the egg. It's an egg. An egg of a mythical and dangerous bird known as the Roc.
Amanda: Oh, the R-O-C.
Julia: So, Sinbad realizes that, despite this being the nest of an extremely dangerous creature, this might be an opportunity. This is a man who likes opportunities, Sinbad. He wants off this island. And, so, what he does is he hides in the nest. He waits for the Roc to land and then he straps himself to the bird’s leg and, somehow, does not die during this plan. I don't understand how this happens.
Amanda: Of all the versions of finds the egg of a mythical creature, this is kind of the best one.
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: You don't disturb the egg. You don't kill anybody. You don't, like, take over their nest. You're just hitching a ride to somewhere else.
Julia: Yeah, there you go. So, the bird takes flight, carries Sinbad away from the island and to a faraway valley, which is good because, no longer on the island, great, but bad in several other ways.
Amanda: Tell me more.
Julia: The valley is impossible to climb out of, which means he’s stuck again. Not great.
Amanda: No.
Julia: Secondly, the valley is filled with the Roc's favorite kind of food, which is huge snakes that can swallow an elephant.
Amanda: Oh, no, I hate when that happens.
Julia: Terrible. Also, he's really hungry and he has no provisions.
Amanda: May I also say, Julia, that I think this is a really good reminder that, sometimes, the thing you can live with is fine. I have been through three pillows in the last two months because the one I was laying on I'm like, “I feel like there could be a better pillow for me.” And then all the other ones I tried are worse. And I threw out the first one because it was very old. I just know that trend in myself. And I now just want to encourage everybody else that, like, if your apartment’s fine, especially if you live somewhere like here in New York, where the apartments you can afford are probably usually bad. You know, if it's fine, that's good. That's better. Don't trade the problems you can deal with for problems you can't.
Julia: Yep, that is true. That is true. Unless, you're very sure of the thing that you're moving into. Like, don't, don't, don't take those risks.
Amanda: I don't want to come out off like anti-adventure or anything. You know, I'm all about like self-improvement. Like, trying the thing. You know, go for it. But, sometimes, okay is fine.
Julia: Yeah.
Amanda: And I just want to encourage us all. If your depression meals are fine, stick with those depression meals. Don't worry about it.
Julia: It's better than not eating at all, right?
Amanda: Better than not eating at all.
Julia: Which is the problem that Sinbad is having right now. He's not eating at all.
Amanda: Oh, damn.
Julia: So, the situation's very dire. The only plus side of being stuck in the valley is that the valley floor is covered in diamonds for some reason.
Amanda: Ooh.
Julia: But that doesn't do anything for Sinbad while he's stuck. He can't eat those diamonds.
Amanda: Sure can't, Julia.
Julia: But Sinbad, as we've kind of come to figure, pretty smart guy. He realizes that the Roc kind of feeds during the day so most of the snakes hide during the daytime so that they won't get eaten. So, he figures this out. He has to hide and stay awake at night, which is kind of rough because he's growing more and more tired. And, when he attempts the next day to kind of nap during the day, he is woken up by, of all things, huge slabs of meat that seemed to be falling from the sky.
Amanda: Ooh, didn't see that one coming.
Julia: No, I didn't either. It takes him a moment. But then Sinbad realizes he knows where he is. So, this is a valley we're merchants, knowing that there's diamonds at the bottom of this valley, would throw meat into the valley hoping that diamonds would stick to the meat and then be carried away by, like, eagles and things like the Roc back to their nests, which then the merchants could raid and then make that bank.
Amanda: Okay. I mean not the worst plan I've ever heard.
Julia: A little convoluted but not terrible. Probably worth chunky diamonds, if I had to guess.
Amanda: Yeah.
Julia: So, Sinbad is like, “Okay. Here we go.” So, he collects a bunch of diamonds. He straps himself to a piece of meat, a big old piece of meat—
Amanda: Oh, oh, bud.
Julia: —which an eagle then picks up and carries back to its nest. And then the merchants who are waiting there for the diamondy meat realized that Sinbad was, you know, a person and rescue him, which is great.
Amanda: I guess lucky for him that the bird likes to eat back at the house and, like, took the menu to go.
Julia: That’s true.
Amanda: Like, if they wanted to dine in, that would have been bad.
Julia: If I remember correctly, it's because they roost in the area. So, they probably bring the food back to feed their, their young ones.
Amanda: Make sense.
Julia: Yeah. So, the merchants rescue Sinbad. They take him back aboard their ship. They return him to Baghdad. And, on the way there, Sinbad does that thing that he did before with the trading until he has even more than just the diamonds he stole from the valley.
Amanda: Wow.
Julia: Now, he's rich again. Woohoo! So, once again, he tells the porter Sinbad like, “Hey, man, here's some more money. Hope you liked the stories. Come back tomorrow if you want to hear more.” And Sinbad the Porter is like, “Yes, definitely. I will see you tomorrow, my new best friend.”
Amanda: Do we hear what he's doing with the money?
Julia: No, I think he's just giving it to his family. Like, making sure that everyone's fed and happy and whatnot.
Amanda: All right.
Julia: I assume good intentions with the money. He keeps coming back.
Amanda: Unless, he gets, like, eaten at the end, this, this has seemed pretty okay.
Julia: I don't think he gets eaten at the end. I can't confirm or deny yet, but I don't think so. So, it happens again. Sinbad the Porter shows back up. Sinbad the Sailor treats him to dinner and whatnot. And then, after the dinner, he sits him back down and tells him about his third voyage. A little bit of a content warning for the third voyage, it’s a little bit kind of, like, xenophobic in that way of the, like, foreign savages trope, just as a heads up. So much like before, Sinbad was really bored being rich in Baghdad. It's a crime worse than death, I guess, for him. And, so, he decides to, once again, set back out to sea. However, his ship is hit by a terrible storm not long after setting out and the ship winds up on the shores of another strange island. This time, it's not a whale. This time, it does not have giant terrible bird on it. What it does have though is – unfortunately, this is where it gets a little xenophobic – a group of two-foot tall, hairy “savages,” who immediately attack the ship when it lands there.
Amanda: Yeah, let's just, you know, shove a bunch of characteristics that we code as, you know, other and evil into one story.
Julia: Yeah, not great, but here we are. So, they managed to actually steal the ship from Sinbad and his crew. And, rather than killing them outright, though, which is good, I guess, they strand the crew on another island and they sail away on the ship.
Amanda: Cool. I mean that's good.
Julia: Yeah, I mean kind of lucky, but not so lucky because they quickly discover, as they explore the island, a chamber on the island covered in human bones.
Amanda: Uh-oh.
Julia: And then a giant cannibal burst in and devours the captain.
Amanda: Okay.
Julia: Like, a literal giant. Like, he is, like, legendary giant status.
Amanda: I meant that sounds good for the people of the other island who did not ask to be, you know, colonized by the ship.
Julia: That's true. That's true and fair. So, the giant leaves the rest of the men after devouring the captain, but the men kind of quickly realized there's no escape. There's no way of getting off this island. And this giant’s just gonna keep coming back and eating us. True to form, the next night, the giant returns and eats another one of the crew members. And they very quickly realized that this is just gonna keep happening unless they do something about it. So, Sinbad, as we know, has a lot of wild plans. And, so, he comes up with another one. This one, less wild than the stuff with the bird, but still kind of buck wild. The sailors attempt to build a raft for themselves out of driftwood. And then they ambush the giant while he's sleeping in his chambers. They stab him in the eye with a flaming stick.
Amanda: Oh, no.
Julia: And then they escaped from the island on their, like, various rafts while he's in pain. Side note, this story is very, very similar to the story of Odysseus and the Cyclops, Polyphemus. Almost like beat for beat kind of.
Amanda: Wow.
Julia: Yeah, the only thing we don't get is the giant screaming out, “Nobody stabbed me,” which is one of my favorite parts of the Odysseus story. As the sailors attempt to escape, they aren't quite in the clear because the giant has a friend, who begins to throw boulders from the island at the rafts. And, soon enough, the rafts are all sunk, except for the one that has Sinbad on it.
Amanda: Classic.
Julia: And he is joined by two other guys, who were lucky enough to be on his raft. They managed to, like, come upon another island, which – sidebar, I was reading about this recently. If you are stranded on an island and, like, the island has resources like drinking water and, like, food, don't try to escape the island. Don't float on a raft. There's no way you're gonna make it to land.
Amanda: There's just no way. You are pretty good as you are. Make some signals. Figure it out. Or just Swiss Family Robinson it, you know.
Julia: Right.
Amanda: And, like, make yourself a cool little treehouse.
Julia: Yeah, the likelihood of you surviving on the sea versus someone finding you on the island and you surviving longer that way. The island’s much better. Don't trust the sea, guys.
Amanda: Never trust the sea.
Julia: It's just like I feel like that's an important lesson to impart in our listeners as we tell stories about rafts and finding islands and stuff. Anyway.
Amanda: Totally. Also, why did they have to hurt the Cyclops? They could have just left under the cover of night.
Julia: They were worried that, like, he would hear them trying to escape or something like that, I guess. So, by, like, causing him pain and blinding him, he wouldn't be able to pursue them.
Amanda: Gotcha.
Julia: Sinbad and those two other guys were lucky enough to be on his raft. They find another island. But, of course, this one's dangerous too. Because why not?
Amanda: I'm just charmed by Sinbad and those two other guys. It’s a pretty good band name.
Julia: It's a pretty good band name. It wouldn't be a long lasting band though because they're attacked by a giant snake who swallows one of the crew members and then, the next day, the other until Sinbad is alone.
Amanda: Oh, classic.
Julia: But, because Sinbad is just like the luckiest son of a bitch on the planet, before he can be eaten the following day, a ship sails by and rescues him.
Amanda: Very lucky.
Julia: Again, stay on the island. The ship will sail by and rescue you.
Amanda: Yeah. Or, like, if you're on a crew with Sinbad, stick with him.
Julia: Yeah, man, until, until you get on the island with a giant snake who then eats you.
Amanda: Also, the worst case scenario, you're gonna put yourself in mortal danger. However, you're probably going to survive the mortal danger that takes out all your co-workers.
Julia: That is true. That is true. I feel like we shouldn't promote, like, very antagonistic work environments in that sense.
Amanda: Not promoting it. I'm just saying, if I were one of these sailors on this voyage and Sinbad is going off about his previous adventures, I'd be like, “Listen, when going gets tough, I'm gonna run in whatever direction Sinbad is running in.” That's all I'm saying.
Julia: He's been pretty lucky so far all things considered or unlucky, depending on how you look at it.
Amanda: Fair.
Julia: So, the ship picks him up. Ironically, it ends up being the ship that had abandoned him during the second voyage—
Amanda: Whoa!
Julia: —that left him on the island with a giant bird.
Amanda: No way.
Julia: So, they're just like, “My bad, can we take you back to Baghdad?” And he's like, “Yes, you can.” So, the ship sails him back to Baghdad. Sinbad does that trading thing again and winds up again with more riches than what he started with. I don't know what he trades this time because I don't remember him finding anything on these islands, but he still manages it somehow. He still gets the paperclip to the car. And, once again, Sinbad the Sailor ends his story there, hand Sinbad the Porter some more money, and is like, “Okay, my guys, see you next time.”
Amanda: [Chuckles]
Julia: And you know what, Amanda? Much in the fashion of both Sinbad the Sailor and our girl, Scheherazade, I'm going to make you come back for more of Sinbad’s tales in another episode.
Amanda: What?! Unprecedented cliffhanger.
Julia: It's been a very long time since we've had a cliffhanger. And I think I will—
Amanda: Wow.
Julia: —I want to survive the night and fall in love with the king. So—
Amanda: Julia, this is third level meta text. Is it my birthday?
Julia: You're welcome.
Amanda: Incredible. Thank you.
Julia: So, I'm going to stay true to form, leave you and the rest of our listeners wanting more.
Amanda: [Laughs]
Julia: So, listeners, stay tuned for our next solo episode where I will tell you the rest of the voyages of Sinbad and a little bit more about, like, the historical context of the stories and just how much of his story might have been plausible.
Amanda: Incredible, Julio. What a power move. I'm in awe.
Julia: I'm so glad. I was like, “Hmm. You know what? It would be a really long episode if we did all of them and the background.” And I was like, “No, you know what? Two. We get two.”
Amanda: It's so good. Well, I'll be just waiting on tenterhooks for the next four weeks, but I cannot wait for part two.
Julia: All right. Well, Amanda, I hope that you are the luckiest son of a bitch in a story like this and that our listeners stay creepy.
Amanda: Stay cool.
Outro Music
Amanda: Spirits was created by Amanda McLoughlin, Julia Schifini, and Eric Schneider with music by Kevin MacLeod and visual design by Allyson Wakeman.
Julia: Keep up with all things creepy and cool by following us @SpiritsPodcast on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and Tumblr. We also have all of our episode transcripts, guest appearances, and merch on our website as well as a form to send us your urban legends at spiritspodcast.com.
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Julia: We are a founding member of Multitude, a collective of independent audio professionals. If you like Spirits, you will love the other shows that live on our website at multitude.productions.
Amanda: And, above all else, if you liked what you heard today, please share us with your friends. That is the very best way to help us keep on growing.
Julia: Thank you so much for listening. Till next time.
Transcriptionist: Rachelle Rose Bacharo
Editor: Krizia Casil