Episode 349: Your Urban Legends LXXXI - Clawfoot Tub Full of Pasta (with Brandon Grugle)
/We’ve dragged our good friend Brandon Grugle onto the show, to talk to him about his love of the supernatural, creepy long shadow fingers, “pleasure caves”, and a clawfoot tub FULL of pasta!
Content Warning: This episode contains conversations about or mentions of racism, death, suicide, ableism, murder, gun violence, domestic violence, and home invasion.
Guest
Brandon Grugle is the Head of Production at Multitude, as well as a composer and sound designer who's worked on podcasts for Marvel, Stranger Things, Netflix, Sony, Wondery, and Atypical Artists, among others. His work has been featured at the Tribeca Film Festival, in countless publications, and even on a Times Square billboard. He lives in Seattle, where he rooftop gardens and collects too much audio gear.
Housekeeping
- Recommendation: This week, Julia recommends Artfully Yours by Joanna Lowell!
- Books: Check out our previous book recommendations, guests’ books, and more at spiritspodcast.com/books
- Call to Action: Check out Pale Blue Pod: an astronomy podcast for people who are overwhelmed by the universe but want to be its friend! New episodes every Monday, wherever you get your podcasts!
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Cast & Crew
- Co-Hosts: Julia Schifini and Amanda McLoughlin
- Editors: Eric Schneider and Brandon Grugle
- Music: Brandon Grugle, based on "Danger Storm" by Kevin MacLeod
- Artwork: Allyson Wakeman
- Multitude: multitude.productions
About Us
Spirits is a boozy podcast about mythology, legends, and folklore. Every episode, co-hosts Julia and Amanda mix a drink and discuss a new story or character from a wide range of places, eras, and cultures. Learn brand-new stories and enjoy retellings of your favorite myths, served over ice every week, on Spirits.
Transcript
[theme]
AMANDA: Welcome to Spirits Podcast, a boozy dive into mythology, legends, and folklore. Every week we pour a drink and learn about a new story from around the world. I'm Amanda.
JULIA: And I'm Julia.
AMANDA: And we are here for another edition of hometown urban legends, your urban legends, in fact, with our friend and colleague, Brandon Grugle.
JULIA: Brandon, hi!
AMANDA: Brandon, how are you?
BRANDON: It's me, but I'm a ghost.
JULIA: Oh, Brandon, when did you become a ghost?
BRANDON: I thought I'd— like joining the— the spirit in the mood, you know?
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Yes.
BRANDON: So, I died last night.
JULIA: That was really kind of you—
AMANDA: Oh, how?
JULIA: —to really get on brand. Like, I feel like a lot of times when people guest on podcasts, you know, they really don't prepare. They just kind of go on and they're like, "Oh, I'm just gonna talk and answer questions." No, Brandon came prepared.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. I go all in. Amanda, I died by sheer force of will.
AMANDA: Great.
JULIA: Cool.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Same.
AMANDA: It's a good start.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. So now it's coffee ghost and regular ghost.
JULIA: That's very good.
AMANDA: Yes. Normally, Brandon's partner shows up in the background of our Join the Party recordings because, of course, Brandon Grugle is the Head of Production at Multitude and our— our co-host, and the editor, and sound designer of Join the Party, and composer for that matter. But we typically just hear her making coffee downstairs, and so she is, of course, the coffee ghost.
JULIA: And sometimes an arm just appears through the doorway behind Brandon—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —hands him a cup of coffee—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —and we're like, "Oh, the coffee ghost is delivering today. Very good, Brandon."
BRANDON: And honestly, if she doesn't have coffee, she is a ghost. So, it works in—
JULIA: That's good.
BRANDON: —multiple levels.
AMANDA: It's good.
BRANDON: It's great, yeah.
JULIA: Makes sense, makes sense.
AMANDA: So, Brandon, apart from cohabitating with one, what is your relationship to the supernatural? I know of you as a very rational person, someone very interested in science, but you're also from the most haunted state, Texas. So, can you tell us a bit about your relationship with ghost stories, urban legends, and the supernatural?
BRANDON: Yeah, I realized— I was thinking about this— this morning when I was getting ready. And I realized I don't think we've talked about this, but I very am a rational, like, logical thinker, but I fucking love the supernatural. Like—
JULIA: Nice.
BRANDON: —it is my favorite— my favorite podcast, at least one of my favorite podcasts is Spooked. I love a ghost story. Even though I may not, like, believe in any of the stuff, like because of that rational side of me. I want ghosts, and cryptids, and wizards, and shit to exist so badly that I just listened to all of it. I want it to happen. I love it. it's my favorite thing.
JULIA: Hell yeah. Brandon, I love that.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: You know, sometimes you can love a thing, even if you're like, "I'm pretty sure this thing doesn't exist but, hey, it's fun to tell stories about it. And, like, that's what half of this podcast is about, so—
BRANDON: Yeah, exactly.
AMANDA: Amazing. Well, are you prepared to pass judgment and commentary on the urban legends of our listeners today?
BRANDON: I'm so stoked.
JULIA: Awesome. Amanda, did you have a juicy one to start us off with?
AMANDA: Oh, I sure do. This one's hot off the presses. It came into the inbox a mere 12 hours ago at the time of recording.
BRANDON: Ah, ah. Oh, ah, ah. Oh, hot.
AMANDA: I know— I know, it's hot, it's hot. And this comes from Abby, she/her, and the subject is the haunted Lemp Family mansion.
JULIA: Uh-oh.
BRANDON: I love a good haunted mansion.
JULIA: Brandon, a famous Disney person who loves the Haunted Mansion.
AMANDA: And this does take place in the state of Missouri, which Google doesn't share a border with Texas, but it's only one state away.
JULIA: Alright.
BRANDON: Honestly, everything is not on the coasts. They're all in one state. It's fine.
JULIA: That's true. Yeah.
AMANDA: It's a big middle. We Google map the other day Minneapolis to Chicago, and we were like, "Fuck! What is in the 7 hours in between those things? It's like so far."
JULIA: Land.
AMANDA: Land.
JULIA: Land.
AMANDA: Alright. So Abby writes, "Hey, Spirits, I'm a longtime listener, first-time writer into the show. Your episodes have kept me company on long drives out of town and at my desk while I tried to tune out my co-workers. Recently, I was listening to a hometown urban legend episode and recall the writer mentioning something about not being able to get an alcoholic drink at their grocery store. I was so confused at that part and realized then that other states have responsible liquor laws. You see, I live in Missouri where you can get a drink pretty much anywhere. We are famous in the region for grocery stores, drugstores, and even gas stations throughout the state which sell a wide variety of beer, wine, and liquor, because there are no state-specific limitations on selling alcohol for "off-premises consumption." We also have open containers and a moving vehicle."
JULIA: What?
BRANDON: Okay, that seems wild.
JULIA: That seems bad. And I go, "Well, that seems bad."
AMANDA: That seems bad. "I thought this was how it was everywhere until I listened to that urban legends episode. Why the lax attitude toward alcohol here you may ask?" Any guesses?
JULIA: Missouri has some sort of like— first off, this is where my thought process is coming from. I found out recently that the Jack Daniels, like, factory where they make the Jack Daniels exists in a dry county, and I was like, "What?"
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: And you can't sell any alcohol except for— at the Jack Daniels factory, which is wild to me.
AMANDA: Yeah. Eric Silver mentioned that at our— our staff happy hour because he has visited before and it means that, like, it is a wild destination with locals buying whiskey because that is the only place you can buy whiskey in that county.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Or anything.
BRANDON: That's brilliant business strategy, honestly.
AMANDA: Right.
JULIA: So maybe there's another— the opposite, maybe there's another place in Missouri that makes famous alcohol and that's why the liquor licenses are so loose?
BRANDON: So, I— I think of the opposite way of like— I think all other states have, like, Christian religious motivated blue laws. And I've only been to Missouri once— well, maybe a couple times, but I've been to Branson, Missouri to see the Osmonds perform.
JULIA: Okay, interesting.
BRANDON: And it's like a very family-friendly state, so I— I don't know.
JULIA: Yeah, as long as you're white.
BRANDON: It's— yeah, as long— I mean, that's true for America, Julia.
JULIA: Yeah, well—
AMANDA: True, true. Well, here's the answer. "Anheuser-Busch, the largest brewing company in the world was created and now is headquartered in my hometown of St. Louis."
BRANDON: Hmm.
JULIA: Called it.
AMANDA: Well done, Julia.
JULIA: Thank you.
AMANDA: "They are at the forefront of keeping Missouri's alcohol laws as relaxed as they are." Don't we love corporate lobbying IRL?" [6:16]
JULIA: Love it.
AMANDA: "All of this to say, it reminded me of another local brewing company just across the street from Anheuser-Busch with a very haunted history."
JULIA: Oh.
AMANDA: Let's get into it.
JULIA: Let's get it.
BRANDON: Let's do it.
AMANDA: "Some background for those of you who haven't been to St. Louis. We have a plethora of three things, potholes, Catholics, and beer. The story I'm gonna tell you is about the Lemp Family and they're brewing business."
JULIA: Alright, alright.
AMANDA: Brandon, does this jive with your experience in Missouri?
BRANDON: Well, my dad's from St. Louis.
JULIA: Oh.
AMANDA: Ooh.
BRANDON: So I've never been and I don't know anything about it.
AMANDA: Amazing.
JULIA: Good. Good.
AMANDA: We can ask him on our next live show. "St. Louis is on the bank of the Mississippi River and was built upon a complex of natural caves, which were once used for the lagering of beer by early German immigrants brewers."
BRANDON: Hell yeah.
AMANDA: "The caves' natural cooler temperatures were attractive to brewers before refrigeration was invented. This plus access to the river's water supply made for a very successful business model. Johann Adam Lemp, one of these German immigrants, began a small brewing business in 1840. And by 1870, it was the largest brewing business in the city and known worldwide with its products shipping internationally. It was uncreatively named the Lemp Brewing Company. He built a large complex above the cave system during his time on the south side of town, and later, his son William Sr. added an adjacent mansion for the family."
JULIA: I feel like brewing companies, nowadays, they have creative names. But, like, back in the day, you know, all the original ones were just like, "This family, they're the ones that brew the beers, so we'll name it after them," like obviously.
AMANDA: Fair enough.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah, like your local cobbler, your grocer. It's just like— it's the people you go to. That's fair.
JULIA: Exactly.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: "So a lot of the brewery complex still stands today over 27 buildings in fact. Though, in varying states of condition, of course, and so does the family mansion nearby, which is said to be one of the most haunted homes in America."
JULIA: Why?
AMANDA: "From 1900 to 1949, 7 untimely deaths occurred in the immediate Lemp Family, most of them within the mansion. In the midst of the company's success, the Lemp Family experienced the first of many tragedies, when Frederick Lemp, William Sr.'s favorite son and heir apparent—"
JULIA: Never good that you have a favorite son.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Never good that you have a favorite son.
AMANDA: Seriously. "Died in 1901 at the age of 28. William Sr. himself died of grief in 1904, later on—"
BRANDON: Of grief?
JULIA: Wait, hold on. How much time was between that and grief?
AMANDA: 3 years.
JULIA: 3 years is not— that— that's not dying of grief.
AMANDA: I think it was like the steady decline of old age precipitated by untimely grief—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —but— okay. So died in 1904. "Later on that year the company was passed to his son William Jr., Billy." Tough when the Jr. is not the favorite, right?
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah. It's like, "You got the name kid, but you don't have the mantle.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: "The rumor is that he had a child through an extramarital affair and they were supposedly hidden in the mansion's attic/servant quarters all their life, eventually dying up there."
JULIA: Classic gothic stuff.
BRANDON: Some Parasite shit.
AMANDA: Yeah. There's a side note here that, "People have claimed that they have seen a young face staring down through the attic window in that mansion." And then Abby says that, "If anyone ends up researching this, there are kind of, like, dark and ableist roots to this myth. So you know, count it warning if you do decide to research it."
JULIA: Hmm.
AMANDA: "When prohibition started, Billy ended up abruptly closing down the brewery." Of course.
JULIA: Billy.
AMANDA: "Business was obviously not booming, and the family members didn't necessarily care about keeping the brewery open for longevity, because they were all already very, very rich. So who cares about the workers' livelihoods or whatever? They'll figure out something to do."
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah. It doesn't matter where their money's gonna come from now, they already have money.
AMANDA: Exactly. "So there were then two further deaths, the Billy in question and his sister Elsa, both were apparent suicides that perhaps were murders. There was a lot of ambiguity and suspicion around both of those deaths. Oh, someone died of a heart attack in '43. In '49, somebody else died by suicide in the house. And the remaining brother, Edwin, moved to a nearby town and lived a long life, dying at the age of 90."
JULIA: Good for Edwin. He was like, "I don't want any of this family drama, I'mma move."
AMANDA: I don't want any of this stuff.
BRANDON: I'm going to come down firmly on the side of those two were murders.
JULIA: Yeah. It seems fair.
AMANDA: It seems that way. A lot of violent gun deaths, also maybe not great to keep a lot of guns in that mansion where people keep dying of gun violence.
JULIA: No.
AMANDA: But who you can say?
JULIA: Yeah, yeah.
AMANDA: "So after Charles' death, the mansion was a boarding house for a time, but as residents complained of ghostly knocks and phantom footsteps being heard throughout the house, it was hard to keep it running."
JULIA: Yeah, kind of classic.
BRANDON: I mean, you got to market into it. You got to start saying that as part of the attraction to the mansion.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: You don't— it's not a bad thing, it's a good thing.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yes! Stay in your own haunted mansion, it's definitely a category in Airbnb.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: I— I think now it is, but like in 19—
AMANDA: Yeah, yeah.
JULIA: —like, 50 when this was probably a boarding house, I don't think there was as much, like, ghostly tourism as there is now, so—
BRANDON: Cowards.
JULIA: I get it. Cowards.
BRANDON: Everyone in 1950 was a coward.
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: Well, you know, they ended up pivoting, guys. Because, "In the mid-70s, the home was bought by a developer in hopes of starting a restaurant and inn. Workmen often told stories during the renovation of tools vanishing, strange sounds, and a fear of being watched. Some workers even refuse to return."
JULIA: Ooh.
AMANDA: "Currently, the mansion is a restaurant and small inn, where the creepy encounters are apparently a still common occurrence. While I have yet to dine or stay overnight and can't share any personal experiences, I've heard lots of different ones from friends and other acquaintances as I've grown up in the city."
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: Remember the cave system I mentioned earlier?
JULIA: I do remember the cave system.
AMANDA: Always, Abby. Always.
BRANDON: Oh, man. It was, like, being— like, "I gotta go lager the beer," was that, like, code for—
JULIA: I gotta go kill a man.
AMANDA: Yeah, yeah. "The family had taken advantage of the caverns, not only for work but also for pleasure."
JULIA: Oh, God.
AMANDA: "There were beer gardens for entertainment—"
JULIA: Okay.
AMANDA: "—a swimming pool, a bowling alley."
BRANDON: In the cave?
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: Cool.
AMANDA: "And even their own private tunnel for the Lemp family to use to get between the mansion and the brewery."
BRANDON: Yo, that's tight.
JULIA: Okay. Yeah—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —I like this. When you said, "For your pleasure," I was like, "Huh."
AMANDA: I know, like orgy like—
JULIA: Weird sex cave.
AMANDA: — cults, yeah, yeah.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Abby adds, "Before you ask, no, you technically can't go explore them. Many of them are closed up from building the interstate. But if you're in the know, you can supposedly find an existing entrance or two." Obviously, I'm not in the know.
JULIA: Yeah. The thing is, the phrase technically did a lot of heavy lifting in that statement.
AMANDA: It did.
BRANDON: Think about caves, is if you just start digging, you will get a cave.
AMANDA: That's fair.
JULIA: Eventually.
AMANDA: One way in, but if you're lucky, more than one way out.
JULIA: Fingers crossed.
AMANDA: But, guys, hope is not lost because, "One exception to this is the haunted house that opens every year to the public underground the brewery inside the cavern system."
BRANDON: Holy shit. That sounds awesome.
AMANDA: Julia, is this best idea ever?
JULIA: I gotta admit, I had no desire to go to Missouri until just now. That sounds terrifying and dope.
BRANDON: What about the Osmonds, Julia?
JULIA: I don't even know who that is, Brandon. Who the fuck is that?
AMANDA: "The haunted house is incredible. It is one of the largest haunt setups in the region and very, very popular. Unlike the mansion, I have been to this spot along with doing some above-ground ghost tours on the brewery property. The vibes are 0 out of 10. It is fully too creepy for me, and I somehow return every year anyway, with a faint hint of bravery until stepping foot onto the property."
JULIA: Babe, stop. Stop doing that to yourself.
AMANDA: We'll go instead. We'll go instead, it'll be fine.
JULIA: Babe, no.
BRANDON: I like that they finally leaned into it, though. They finally got it, you know?
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: "So there you have it. I don't know about you, but I haven't heard of many places that have a haunted house, haunted mansion, haunted caves, and a haunted inn all rolled into one. If you're ever in St. Louis, take some time to drink a beer, eat toasted ravioli, and maybe run into a ghost or two. Just watch out for the potholes."
JULIA: Is toasted ravioli a thing?
BRANDON: The spookiest part of the story is toasted ravioli. What is that?
JULIA: Yeah. It's that, like, not fried ravioli, but kind of fried ravioli.
AMANDA: Breaded deep-fried ravioli, created and popularized in St. Louis.
BRANDON and JULIA: Okay.
JULIA: Alright.
BRANDON: Okay, I'm into it.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: I mean, it sounds great.
BRANDON: Yeah, I'd eat it.
AMANDA: I'm into it.
JULIA: I'll try it.
BRANDON: The thing that, like, surprises me about that story is that like— you know that, like, adage of, like, relationships where you're like, "If something goes wrong in the first relationship, it's sad. If something goes wrong— the same thing goes wrong in the second relationship, it's bad luck. If it something— same thing goes wrong in the third relationship, like look at what you're doing wrong.
JULIA: You're the problem, yeah.
BRANDON: You're the problem.
AMANDA: I have not, but I'm with you.
JULIA: Hmm.
BRANDON: Like, 9 deaths into this house, you don't look at the house and be like, "Do we have any, like, loose boards of the floor or like—"
JULIA: We have a slow gas leak happening—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —is that why everyone is, like, being driven to gun violence? Like, what's happening here?
AMANDA: Exactly. Electrical currents, I totally agree. And that's why I love the anecdote about Edwin who lived to a ripe old age of 90 in—
BRANDON: Yeah.
AMANDA: —outside of the home.
JULIA: Bless him.
AMANDA: Like Edwin, self-care king.
BRANDON: I love it. I love it.
JULIA: Shout-out to Edward for his self-care.
BRANDON: I want to be in a haunted house so bad, so I can, like, go science on it, where I'm like, "Alright. If I move the house 10 feet over so, does it still get haunted?"
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: "If I tear down the house and build a new house, is it still haunted?"
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: And just try all these variables and figure out what the actual haunting is.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: And then go from there, you know?
JULIA: Well, cause sometimes— and this is going off of the idea that perhaps, you know— Brandon, I know you don't think ghosts are real, but the idea that like a lot of times, sometimes a spirit will, like, inhabit a house, but then will attach itself to a person or a family. So even after they move, they still, like, experienced the haunting and stuff like that. So—
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: I think it depends on the type of ghost.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: That's my hot take.
BRANDON: Yeah. But then I nail down the type of ghost and then I can relate to the ghost better, Julia. And then we'd become best friends.
JULIA: Hmm. Well, Brandon, the best way of living with a ghost is being as polite as possible to that ghost—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: —because—
BRANDON: That's true.
JULIA: —politeness and ghosts work well together. That's something we've learned from the show.
BRANDON: Just like I am with my Google Home.
JULIA: Yes, correct.
BRANDON: Just in case.
JULIA: Just in case the actuality happens, Brandon's ready to go. Well, I have one, and we can hear about the first part of the story now, and then we'll get back to the second half when we get back from our refill. How does that sound?
BRANDON: That sounds great.
AMANDA: Ooh, a cliffhanger.
JULIA: So this is from Talyn and they have titled this email Old Spaghetti Factory and I was a creepy small child that saw ghosts.
AMANDA: Yay.
JULIA: Yeah. So Talyn writes, "Hi, I'm kind of a new listener. I've been listening to the podcast for about a year and a half now, but not quickly and in order from oldest to newest." Bless your heart, Talyn. Bless.
AMANDA: Also, Talyn hasn't even gotten up to the spaghetti warehouse spectacular.
JULIA: Well, "I have hit the spaghetti warehouse, Old Spaghetti Factory saga."
AMANDA: There you go.
JULIA: "I'm listening to episode 54 as I write this."
AMANDA: No, no, Julia. I'm talking about 64, which is the special spaghetti episode.
JULIA: Oh.
BRANDON: Oh, yeah, yeah.
JULIA: Maybe they're talking about 64 and just did a mistype, but potentially—
AMANDA: Well, we— we read many stories about—
JULIA: Yes.
AMANDA: —spaghetti factory before we—
JULIA: That is true.
AMANDA: —built up to the grand climax.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: So Talyn writes, though, that they wanted to throw their two cents into the conversation." So I'm from British Columbia, Canada, and we have a Old Spaghetti Factory location in Abbotsford, the town over from my hometown. I can say that we definitely never had an old trolley car in our location." With many question marks at the end of that statement.
AMANDA: Bummer. Bummer.
JULIA: "I can, however, confirm that my parents freaking hated going, because they didn't like the vibes."
AMANDA: Ooh.
JULIA: "I, as a child who often saw ghosts in my bedroom, will elaborate later, love The Old Spaghetti Factory, and also I just have a lifelong love of pasta." Same, Talyn. Same.
BRANDON: Don't we all?
JULIA: "I don't specifically remember any ghost stories out of the Abbotsford location. I do however remember that the parking lot was very creepy, but probably unrelated."
AMANDA: I would say when we went to a physical spaghetti warehouse, it was a creepy parking lot abutting a sort of like unprotected railroad, so that checks out for me.
JULIA: And other listeners have sent in pictures of their local spaghetti warehouse and spaghetti factories. And I remember we did a Google—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: —Earth view. And one of them was right near a very scary, like, tunnel that went underneath train tracks, and I was like, "Oh, no, never going to that one."
BRANDON: No.
JULIA: Yup, not with my life.
AMANDA: Maybe their real estate strategy is affordable warehouses next to, I don't know, freight lines for the rails and for the warehouse, I get it.
BRANDON: I mean, the profit margin on pasta is not very high, so—
JULIA: No, it's cheap.
AMANDA: You got to figure it out.
JULIA: It's cheap to get pasta.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Talyn also says, "I do remember that, apparently, the pasta was stored in a giant clawfoot bathtub in the kitchen, because—"
BRANDON: What?
JULIA: "—they used so much per day."
BRANDON: That— are you sure you didn't dream that, Talyn?
AMANDA: That sounds incredible.
JULIA: I don't know. "My parents told me so many weird things as a child." So that might have been a lie from your parents, Talyn.
AMANDA: Oh, okay.
JULIA: I'm just gonna say it right now. Might have been a lie from your parents.
BRANDON: I mean, it's so weird that, like, it has to be true, though, right? Like, why would you make that up?
AMANDA: Just for fun. I once told my sister that there were clowns on the wings of airplanes that put down the landing gear. Like, if you look carefully, you can see them sometimes. And it was the one bullying lie I ever told my siblings.
BRANDON: That's very funny.
JULIA: I just— we've talked about this on the show. I don't understand why people enjoy lying to children. I can't— I get it like— but at the same time, I'm like— I feel like I would have been so pissed at my parents when I found out that they, like, lied to me about something that I truly believed until adulthood.
AMANDA: Yeah.
BRANDON: Yeah.
AMANDA: Well, Brandon, we rarely get the chance to poll a youngest child. Did your siblings tell you any wild lies?
BRANDON: Well, that's what I was thinking about when you're saying that. It's like I don't think— well, one, my oldest brother is, like, 8 years older than me, so like—
AMANDA: Not a lot to open up.
BRANDON: —that time I was like—
AMANDA: Yeah.
BRANDON: —in college. My sister and I were really close, so she didn't really, like, screw me over like that. But I have convinced my little niece, who is 6, that I think that the soda brand Sprite is pronounced Spronk.
JULIA: Oh, my God, good.
AMANDA: That's good, yeah.
BRANDON: And so now, every time—every time— she loves Sprite, so I ask her, "Oh, you want a Spronk?"
AMANDA: That's really good. That's perfect. It's perfect. But now— but she may be in college when someone's like, "You realize he was fucking with you, right?" And she's like, "Oh, okay."
JULIA: But she knows it's not called Spronk, right? She just thinks you're a little silly man who thinks it's pronounced Spronk?
BRANDON: Who can say? I'm very silly, Julia.
AMANDA: Incredible.
JULIA: I do what I can, Brandon, to defend you, but sometimes I'm just like, "Maybe your little niece thinks you're a silly little man." And you're like, "Probably." So I'll tell you a little bit more about Talyn and their ability to see ghosts as a small child. But first, why don't we grab our refill?
AMANDA: Let's do it.
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JULIA: Hey, this is Julia, and welcome to the refill. First of all, of course, we have to thank our newest patrons, Lilith, Amanda, and Cecilia, welcome, welcome, welcome. You join the ranks of people like our supporting producer-level patrons, Uhleeseeuh, Anne, Brittany, Froody Chick, Hannah, Jack Marie, Jane, Kneazlekins, Lily, Matthew, Megan Moon, Nathan, Phil Fresh, Rikoelike, Captain Jonathan MAL-uh-kye Cosmos, Sarah and Scott. And, of course, our legend-level patrons, Arianna, Audra, Bex, Chibi Yokai, Morgan, Morgan H., Sarah, and Bea Me Up Scotty. And you too can join our Patreon at patreon.com/spiritspodcast and get a bunch of cool rewards like recipe cards for every episodes, bonus urban legends episodes each month and so much more. Check it out at patreon.com/spiritspodcast. I also want to let you know, hey, we have new merch for sale. You can get our five new Tarot designs on a black T-shirt plus an updated logo T-shirt at spiritspodcast.com/merch. I'm really happy with these, they look so amazing. The incredible art by Zoe is just like so highlighted by these awesome shirts, and I really love the classic black color. So, I think you're going to love them, too. Again, that is at spiritspodcast.com/merch. I also have a recommendation for you, which is— hey, I have bad insomnia sometimes, and one of my favorite things to do when I know that I'm not going to be able to get back to sleep is read some books on my phone. I use Libby to access my library and use ebooks through that, it's fantastic. And I have a guilty pleasure, and so I've been guilty. I have the pleasure of reading some really fun romance novels when I can't sleep. It's a great way to like lull me back to sleep eventually. And my recommendation for you today is a book called Artfully Yours by Joanna Lowell. Is it the third book in a series? Yes. Did I realize that while I was reading it? No. It really doesn't matter. I really liked this one as a kind of entryway into the series, which I'm now in the middle of right now. And Joanna Lowell just, like, hits the spot for me and the combination of, like, art and regency romance, and plot twists, and it's a lot of fun, so check that one out. And while you're checking things out, check out Pale Blue Pod. Pale Blue Pod is a astronomy podcast for people who are overwhelmed by the universe, but also want to be its friend. Astrophysicist Dr. Moiya McTier and comedian Corinne Caputo de-mystify space one topic at a time with open eyes, open arms, and open mouths from all of the laughter, but also the jaw-dropping information about the universe and space. By the end of each episode, the cosmos will feel a little bit less, "Ah, too scary," and a little bit more, "Ooh, so cool." There are new episodes every Monday and you can get them wherever you get your podcasts. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. 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Miss the sale, visit brooklinen.com, and sign up for emails to keep up to date on exclusive offers, new products, and much more. And now, let's get back to the show.
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JULIA: We are back. And Brandon, I have to ask you, what have you been enjoying lately in terms of drinks, that is—
BRANDON: Ooh.
JULIA: —cocktails, or mocktails, or otherwise?
BRANDON: Well, Julia, I— and if you're a subscriber to the Multitude newsletter, I'm going to talk about my CSA in the newsletter.
JULIA: Ooh.
BRANDON: But I got some cucumbers in my CSA, and I didn't know what to do with them. So, I was going to make some agua fresca and I was like, "Hold up. What if I make agua—"
AMANDA: Brain blast.
BRANDON: Brain blast. "What if I make a concentrate of agua fresca?" Because I don't add the water, I just do the juice.
AMANDA: Ooh.
JULIA: My guy is so good.
BRANDON: Yeah. 'Cause I made like a cucumber mint concentrate, and then I made, like, mint syrup, like mint simple syrup.
AMANDA: Yes.
BRANDON: And so I've been adding that— those two things, and mezcal, and celery bitters.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: Oh.
BRANDON: Which are very good.
AMANDA: Brandon.
JULIA: For people who are not familiar with Brandon's work and his oeuvre, Brandon loves a tincture.
AMANDA: He's a tincture man.
JULIA: A fancy bitter so much. He has like a apothecaries cabinet worth of tinctures and— and cocktail accoutrements.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: The first time Eric and I went over to Brandon's apartment to record Join the Party, which is where we used to record Join the Party back in— in Queens, we rolled up and we're like, "Uh, Brandon, what's this beautiful bar cart filled with unmarked bottles?" It was just filled with tinctures. It was incredible. And since then, every time we visit, the first thing Eric asks is, "Let me see the tinctures."
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. And it's just been ever growing since then, so—
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: I have recently been trying to get into the tincture game a bit more, Brandon. And recently, we had a friend over to our house for the first time, so I had a couple of, like, unmarked bottles that were, like, filled with stuff that I know what it is just from like sniffing it.
BRANDON: Poison.
JULIA: But he— yes, poison. So he, like, wandered over and I had some, like, orange blossom water in a diffuser.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: And he just, like, looks at it and he, like, picks it up. He, like, gives a little sniff and he kinds of just sprays it, and he goes, "Oh." "Yes, that is orange blossom water." He's like, "Nice." And I'm like, "Thank you.”
BRANDON: You know that you've gone to the cocktail dark side when you have atomizers like sprayers. That's when you know.
JULIA: Yeah.
BRANDON: That's the line where you're like, "Oh, I'm in this for life now."
AMANDA: That's the line.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah. And that's fine.
AMANDA: Right now, I have one with, like, saline spray for my piercings, like does that—
BRANDON: Ooh.
AMANDA: Is that good?
JULIA: If you put that in your cocktails, then yeah.
BRANDON: I was gonna say, honestly—
AMANDA: I could.
BRANDON: — it would be pretty good. Saline spray is like this summer's new thing. Like, people are adding that to like margaritas and stuff. Like, it seems really good.
AMANDA: I mean— wow. Alright.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Amanda, you're ahead of the game and you don't even know it.
AMANDA: Hey.
JULIA: So let's get back to Talyn's second half of the story, which was "I was a creepy small child that saw a ghosts!"
AMANDA: Yay.
JULIA: "My second story/anecdote is about me being a so-called creepy child. I'm so not sorry about being a former creepy child because, hey, content. Anyway, I, as a child, had what I called my quote, "Victorian man" that lived in the corner of my room, by my closet that face my bed. I remember seeing him. He had circled glasses, an amazing hat, and a generally amazing Victorian getup. Honestly, he was never very mean and I only ever got bad vibes when I had already had a bad day." So maybe this, like, ghost was just, like, very on vibe with you, and so when— you know when like—
AMANDA: Hmm.
JULIA: —your partner is grumpy, so like you end up being a little grumpy as well—
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: —because you're just like, "Why can't we just be happy at the same time, you know?
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. And Julia's partner is also a Victorian ghost.
JULIA: Yes, famously— famously Jaked Ziti is a Victorian ghost. "However, my friends did get to meet Victorian man's creepier friend when we were teenagers."
BRANDON: No.
JULIA: Yeah, yeah.
BRANDON: I have a question, actually, real quick.
JULIA: What's up?
BRANDON: Because I just realized while we were listening to the story, Victorian woman ghosts much—
JULIA: Hmm.
BRANDON: —creepier than Victoria man ghost, right?
JULIA: No. I think the Victorian woman ghost is actually less creepy because usually, she's like a victim of, like—
BRANDON: Hmm.
JULIA: —domestic assault or like— and you feel bad for her.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: A Victorian man, I would have bad vibes from, because I would be like, "What, did you die on the Titanic, you fucking capitalist?"
BRANDON: You're totally right. I was picturing like a goofy like, "Hello, Guv'na." But you're absolutely right. Like, any man in the Victorian age definitely did a semi-murder at some point in their life.
JULIA: Uh-hmm. We just talked about this with the last house that we were talking about. We're just like, "Everyone but Edwin, you know, bad vibes."
BRANDON: Yup, you're right. You're right.
AMANDA: Interesting. I feel like I— I would definitely know what I was looking at if I saw a Victorian woman ghost and I'd be like, "Oh, you probably have some tragic backstory. Let me you know, make my peace with you." And that's, you know, a little jolt of scary. I think if I saw a Victoria man ghost, I would laugh. I think that's a lot less scary to me. I think it'd be like, "Look at the funny hat." Because they never went anywhere with that hats. And these days nobody wears a hat.
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: That was my initial thought, too. Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Interesting, interesting.
AMANDA: That's what I think.
JULIA: Conspirators, let us know if you think Victorian woman or Victorian man would be a creepier ghost.
BRANDON: We can all agree a Victoria non-binary, not creepy at all, dope to hang out with.
JULIA: Yes, incredible.
AMANDA: Exactly. Any kind of gender fluid or non-binary ghost, I'm like, "Tell me about your experience, and let me tell you about stuff now."
JULIA: What's your vibe?
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: So Talyn's friends met the Victorian man's creepier friend when they were teenagers. "My friend Abby claimed that she experienced sleep paralysis in a paranormal way, she clarified, and met a very tall man in an also Victorian get-up, but was definitely not my guy, because I had saw him that night. Also, the figure that Abby saw had long black finger-like things from his hands—"
BRANDON: No, thanks.
JULIA: "—and reportedly hovered over her until he decided, it/he, was done and decided to let her go back to sleep."
BRANDON: No, thanks.
JULIA: No, not good?
BRANDON: Nope.
JULIA: Not a big fan of creepy, long shadow fingers?
BRANDON: No, thank you. Have either of you two had sleep paralysis before?
JULIA: I think I had it probably more often than I realize now as a child. Like I remember I would, like, be frozen in bed staring at a thing on, like, my wall. And then later on be like, "Oh, it was, like, the sweater that I— they hung up there or something like that." But, like, could not move out of bed to save myself, so—
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: No, which is why me and Julia, and Julia's— Julia—
JULIA: Woo!
BRANDON: I want to come on at some point and talk about my spooky demon sleep paralysis episode.
JULIA: Brandon.
AMANDA: Brandon, the time is now, sorry.
JULIA: The time is now, you're already on the pod. You can—
AMANDA: You're on the podcast, let's do it.
JULIA: Talk about it now. Actually, Brandon, let me finish this story—
BRANDON: Yeah, I wanna know the end of the story. Yeah.
JULIA: —and then— no, this is perfect, and then you can talk about this. So, they decided to name him Philip. "And as I have never seen Phillip myself, I cannot entirely vouch for his existence. But I do believe Abby because she refused to ever sleep in my living room after she saw him again the next night."
BRANDON: Don't blame them.
JULIA: So Abby saw Philip twice in a row, that's no good.
AMANDA: That's serious.
BRANDON: No, thanks.
JULIA: Anyway, "We honestly love the Victorian man and are iffy on Philip." Now, a side note before we leave Talyn, which they said, "Holy shit. What is with creepy grandpas and bloody bones? I should not be listening to this episode at 2:00 A.M. Alright, I hope you all are well and never meet Philip, though he did not seem entirely threatening... Talyn."
BRANDON: I mean, those long fingers disagree with that statement.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah. I mean, but like he didn't do anything creepy with the long fingers. The long fingers were just there.
BRANDON: He simply had them, but that wasn't enough for me to—
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah. I mean—
JULIA: Alright.
AMANDA: —my first thought, must be great at piano. Second thought—
JULIA: Doesn't have to stretch those fingies at all.
AMANDA: Could be creepy, could be creepy.
JULIA: Yeah, could be creepy.
BRANDON: Great guitarist, great pianist.
AMANDA: Yeah. Alright, Brandon, the time is now, we have to hear about your sleep paralysis experience.
BRANDON: Yeah. So when I was middle school-ish, like that period of, like, transition from, like, 5th grade through like 8th grade, you know? I guess I just wasn't sleeping enough. I— I must not have been sleeping enough. But I got into the habit of— I would get home from— maybe it was high school, because I get home at, like, 2:30. You know, when like high school gets out earlier than other schools for some reason. I don't know why.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: But I would get home, and my mom is a teacher, so she would still be at elementary school, which went longer. So I would frequently go up to the game room and just, like, take a nap while watching TV, almost every day. But I guess I just wasn't getting enough sleep or something, because I would, like, fall into these weird, like, almost like stuper sleeps. Like, it would— they were very uncomfortable. Like, I would fall asleep and I can sort of, like— the description I gave my dad when I was asking him, "What the fuck was going on with me?" Because he's a doctor. It was like I could— it felt like the— like, the neurons firing in my brain, I could, like, feel them.
AMANDA: Woah.
BRANDON: Like, these, like, pulses of electricity, and they were, like, painful. Like, they weren't like— they weren't like painful, like someone, like, stabbing me. But they were very, very uncomfortable—
AMANDA: Yeah, yeah.
BRANDON: —and painful.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: And that's when I knew that, like, I was falling asleep badly, right? Like, something was going wrong—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —and I couldn't get out of it. Like, I couldn't wake myself up.
AMANDA: Oh, no.
BRANDON: And so this happened a lot. Like, I would get that sort of mild sleep paralysis. And then the first time I actually had sleep paralysis, I was at my dad's house, 'cause my parents were separated. And I took a nap on the couch, and on waking up, I was fully conscious but, like, couldn't move, obviously, because of sleep paralysis.
AMANDA: Damn.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: And I was like, "What the fuck is happening? I can't open my eyes." And in your head, I was thinking— you know, you have me on the podcast, I gotta match— mentioned Supernatural. I always think of that Supernatural scene where Dean goes to hell for the first time and he's like in chains. In your head, you're like screaming, you're like, "Wake up, wake up, wake up, wake up, wake up." and you just simply cannot.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Wow.
BRANDON: Which is awful. When I had the actual experience, I was at my home, and had gotten home from school, and went to take a nap on our couch.
JULIA: Brandon, you got to stop napping. This is the key here.
AMANDA: Brandon, I'm sorry, I have to bust it. You have to stop napping on couches, my guy.
JULIA: Stop napping on couches.
BRANDON: I was ve— this is what I'm saying. I just clearly wasn't getting enough sleep. This is why high school should be later and not end at 2:30.
AMANDA: I know, I know.
BRANDON: Adolescents need more sleep. But I took a nap on the couch, and thought I had woken up, right? Like—
AMANDA: Sure.
BRANDON: —I had the perfect image of my living room in my head. But I woke up and I couldn't move, right? So I'm like on my, like, side, I can see the wall— there's a wall in front of me, and then like off of my peripheral is where like the bedrooms and stuff are. So, like, there's like a hallway and, like, that's where stuff happens in the house.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
Brandon: And—
JULIA: That's where the stuff happens.
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Gotcha.
BRANDON: And on that wall, the— I see, like, a shadow starts to form.
JULIA: Uh-oh.
BRANDON: And I can't move. And then ultimately, like, I— you start feeling this, like, presence, right? Like, there's no other way to say it. Like, you feel like the enormity of this presence. And for some reason, you— I eventually come to realize that, like, there's, like, probably like 10— we have a pretty high ceiling, so, like, yeah, a 10-foot—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —demon thing coming out of the back room, and, like, coming towards me. And you can't move, and you can't do anything, you can't scream. You're at the complete mercy of whatever this demon thing wants to come do to you. And it was awful. And it felt— you know, in the moment, I'm sure it was like, you know, 2 minutes or whatever, or a minute, but it feels like— it's like 20. It was horrifying.
JULIA: Gosh, it was bad, Brandon.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Brandon, it seemed like a bad time for you.
BRANDON: Yeah, it was not good.
AMANDA: Did you stop napping on couches?
BRANDON: I didn't.
JULIA: Brandon.
BRANDON: But I did eventually started getting more sleep.
JULIA: Okay. And then the sleep paralysis basically stopped?
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Alright, that's good.
BRANDON: I think, like, once I started getting actual restful sleep like—
AMANDA: Yeah.
BRANDON: Yeah.
AMANDA: The neuron thing you mentioned reminds me of— I had growing pains a lot—
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: —when I was like, you know, 11, 12, 13, as did my siblings, where— just, like, shooting pain, like your nerves are on fire, like in your shins, and ankles, and feet.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: In our cases, our elbow sometimes as just, like, your body grows. And that's just a thing that happens to adolescence, which is— like we went to the doctor, he was like, "You have growing pains. It happens." And I was like, "What?"
JULIA: What do you mean it just happens?
BRANDON: I feel like we should— the doctors— or like some sort of class in school should tell you these things of like—
AMANDA: Yeah.
BRANDON: "—Hey, you might experience growing pains. Don't freak out, that's normal. Hey, some people get sleep paralysis such as this. Hey, don't freak out.
AMANDA: Instead of just, "Don't have sex, that's the only way that you're not going to die." Yeah.
JULIA: Uh-hmm. Also, you're going to get your period. You don't know what that is yet, but we're gonna tell you it's not fun.
AMANDA: Don't ask me more questions.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah, can't tell you anything more about it.
BRANDON: Or like if you start thinking you're seeing— you know, your house is haunted, you might check your carbon monoxide just to be sure—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —that it's actual haunting—
AMANDA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —and not cover them up like—
AMANDA: Yeah.
BRANDON: Why don't we tell people these things?
AMANDA: I don't know. And it's why I respect middle school teachers especially, because I remember our middle school math teacher was like, "By the way, you guys should be washing your feet. I don't know if anyone told you that, but you should." And a bunch of people in class were like, "Oh, yeah. No, that's good. Yeah, we should."
BRANDON: Oh, God.
JULIA: Good fact. Good note, good note.
BRANDON: Who was the person in class the teacher was like— oh, God.
JULIA: The sandals kid.
AMANDA: I think she might've just said it. Her, like, quirk was that she wore like interesting socks, like socks with patterns and maybe it was just like— I don't know.
JULIA: Feet were her thing.
AMANDA: On her mind.
BRANDON: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah. I don't know about that. But anyway, that was horrifying. Brandon, I did select two little presents for you for the end of this episode.
JULIA: Little prezzies.
AMANDA: Yes. So the first one is going to be a ghostly cocktail experience, and the second one is a logical explanation for a hometown haunting.
BRANDON: Ooh.
JULIA: Yay!
BRANDON: I'm delighted.
JULIA: With little treats for our friend.
AMANDA: A little treat, allows this to wash away the memory of your recurring sleep paralysis. Okay. This comes from Sylvia, she/her, and it's titled Your cocktail recommendation gave me a ghost.
JULIA: Oh, okay.
AMANDA: So, Brandon, wait for the second reason why I chose this one for you.
BRANDON: Okay.
AMANDA: Sylvia writes, "Hi, all. I rarely experienced any paranormal, supernatural, or spooky stuff. So when your cocktail recommendation invoked a spirit in my home, I had to share it."
JULIA: Oops. Uh-oh. My bad. That's on me, folks.
AMANDA: "I've been working my way through the full Spirits catalog, and I just listened to Episode 312: Poltergeist from Myth Movie Night. In the episode, you recommend a cocktail called the Green Ghost that only needs gin, green Chartreuse, and lime juice."
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Yes. And I would do it again.
BRANDON: Also very close to the last word, which is—
JULIA: Yes.
BRANDON: —now I'm realizing a very threatening cocktail name.
JULIA: And my favorite, Brandon.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: My favorite cocktail of all time. And, like, a lot of times you don't have Maraschino liqueur on hand, so the Green Ghost is the perfect like—
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: —comparison, you know?
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Yeah. Julia is like, "Yes, it's the last word. Yes, it's the last call. Little soupcon of mystery with her cocktail at first.
JULIA: Love a soupcon.
AMANDA: "I've been searching for recipes that require Green Chartreuse since I bought it back for a themed birthday party last year."
JULIA: Good.
AMANDA: "So hearing about this cocktail, it was really exciting to me, and I started to make one for myself. I poured the gin into a glass and put the shot glass I used to measure the gin back on my counter. As I was putting away the gin and chatting with my friend Emily, who was hanging out with me, the shot glass started gliding across the counter toward the Green Chartreuse."
BRANDON: No. You got— you got the 1 in 1 million bottle that has a ghost with it.
JULIA: Hmm, fun.
AMANDA: Now, guys, I know you're both huge fans of Chartreuse. Is this—
BRANDON: Yes.
AMANDA: —involves with the monks? Is it demonic? Is it ironic? Is it a branding strategy? What's happening here?
JULIA: Well, Amanda, I think given the fact that it's made by two monks, probably not demonic. I'm gonna go ahead right there and say not demonic.
BRANDON: Well, Julia, let me pitch you this idea. Maybe this was like— they had like a demon exorcism situation where they had, like, throw it in the bottle quickly and they were like, "This is the only one that's close to us."
AMANDA: Oh, it was around.
BRANDON: It was around, yeah.
AMANDA: Right. 'Cause it was like the bottling facility.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Oh.
JULIA: Perhaps, Brandon. I'll allow it.
BRANDON: Thanks.
AMANDA: Now, a couple times like if your counter has, like, a bit of a pitch to it or bit of a lean and it's wet, like things can slide. Like you put a glass down and it slides. And you're like, "Oh, no, my counter was wet." So that was what I was thinking, but let's continue.
BRANDON: Right.
AMANDA: "I called Emily over to watch with me to make sure I wasn't just seeing things, and place the shot glass firmly back where I had originally put it. I joked with her that this cocktail must have evoked some spirit, and that the spirit must love Green Chartreuse."
JULIA: It was me.
AMANDA: "As I jokingly welcomed the ghost, "Welcome ghost enjoy my chartreuse." The shot glass again slid toward the chartreuse bottle and stopped.
JULIA: Here's the thing, you should not have been like, "Oh, ghost, enjoy this cocktail that I'm making for myself." Make the ghost its own cocktail.
BRANDON: Yeah, for sure.
AMANDA: There you go, Julia.
BRANDON: It's like putting milk out for a little stray cat.
AMANDA: Yes.
JULIA: Yes. Or like— or like bread out for a brownie.
AMANDA: Bread out for a brownie. Exactly.
JULIA: Or— yeah.
AMANDA: Exactly. You gotta.
JULIA: You gotta.
AMANDA: "So without touching the shot glass this time, I then invited the ghost to share my drink with me."
JULIA: Uh-uh.
AMANDA: "The glass proceeded to slide again, yet closer to the bottle of chartreuse."
BRANDON: No.
JULIA: It's literally saying, "Make me one yourself. "
AMANDA: Yes!
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Make me my own.
AMANDA: Just pour some, put in there.
BRANDON: I'm fucking thirsty! Come on, get it!
AMANDA: Yeah! You've had this bottle for years, and now you've just found out about this recipe, come on. So, "I asked if they were a friendly ghost and it slid again. Thoroughly freaked out, I grabbed the shot glass, finish making the cocktail, and cheers to the ghost before drinking." Now, again, Julia, I totally agree with you. I think the— the move here is to make two, put one on the counter, cheers it, and then leave the room.
JULIA: Of course.
AMANDA: Let the ghost enjoy their cocktail in peace. Let them decide if they're going to come join you in the other room or have some solitude, you know?
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
JULIA: Yes, exactly.
AMANDA: "I joked with Emily that the ghost must be friendly and maybe even a drinking buddy. I'm now referring them to Gigi in honor of the green ghost cocktail, that first allow them to communicate with me."
JULIA: Cute.
AMANDA: "Thank you for the cocktail recommendation. This new ghostly drinking buddy and all of your great Spirits Podcast shenanigans. I'll keep you updated if Gigi continues to haunt."
JULIA: Just leave a shout-out for Gigi every time you make a—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —drink now. Just like— you don't even have to do a full cocktail for Gigi—
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: —you know? like just— just a little bit of sip of liqueur and you're good to go.
BRANDON: I do have now a thought. What's worse, a regular ghost or a drunk ghost?
AMANDA: Interesting.
JULIA: I mean, the answer is a drunk ghost, Brandon.
AMANDA: Yes. No, that's definitely worse, because it's even more unpredictable. But I— I think you could look into a ghost that is a sleepy drunk, that is a—
BRANDON: Hmm.
AMANDA: —funny drunk, but not in a way that, like, pranks you. Maybe a cuddly drunk and then you get, like, all the ghostly chills. Yeah, all of them sound bad.
BRANDON: Hmm..
AMANDA: Yup. Nope. I've talked my way— myself into a good answer.
JULIA: Amanda, I love watching you walk your way into the correct answer. It's always good.
AMANDA: Yeah. I do also want to say, so we've talked about the Jack Daniels distillery, and do you guys know the term the Angel's Share?
BRANDON: Uh-hmm.
JULIA: I do.
AMANDA: This is like— yeah, the percentage of liquor, or wine, or something in a barrel that has been barely— should still— that evaporates and you, you know, count on a certain amount evaporating over time, because that's like how molecules work. And that's called the angel's Share.
BRANDON: Also a great bar in New York that is now closed. RIP, but—
JULIA: RIP.
AMANDA: Exactly.
BRANDON: Yes.
JULIA: I'd be drinking with the angels now.
AMANDA: Yeah. I think what Julia is suggesting is simply the ghosts share.
BRANDON: Hmm.
AMANDA: Just pour them a little bit, little bit, leave it out. Let them enjoy it on their own time. And whether it evaporates or a ghost drank it, who knows?
BRANDON: Who can say?
JULIA: Who can say?
BRANDON: Like, oftentimes, a lot of cocktails like you'll do like an absinthe rinse—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —where, like, you pour a tiny bit of absinthe in the drink, and then just, like, rotate the glass, and— and drop it out. Just instead of, like, dropping that into the sink or whatever it is, like put it into a little— little glass and give it to your ghost.
JULIA: Yeah.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Yeah.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: And also you'll probably catch any fruit flies in your house.
BRANDON: Exactly.
AMANDA: Very helpful. Alright, Brandon. And then my final little treat for you is a short hometown logical haunting from Rowan, they/them.
BRANDON: Okay.
JULIA: Shout out, Rowan.
AMANDA: Rowan writes, "Hey, Spirits, I was just catching up and heard about some logical hauntings in Episode 331, reminding me of my current situation at my mom's house. Ever since we moved here back around 2018, I've heard knocking on random doors and windows in the house even when no one is home. Today happened to be one of those days. When I heard the knock, I quickly went to see if anyone was there, desperate for some kind of interaction, whether it be a spirit of some kind, or even an intruder, frankly. I've been stuck inside the house for a week due to illness and had minimal contact with the outside world, so I got pretty lonely."
JULIA: Okay, hold on. I understand the kind of, like, Cabin Fever situation of being stuck in the house for a while. I think we all do at this point.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: But a week is not enough time to be like, "Oh, I hope it's an intruder."
AMANDA: Yeah. No, I— I get it. I get it—
JULIA: What?
AMANDA: —but also I don't get it at all. "When I reached the room, however, nothing was there. Disappointed, I was about to go back to my room when I heard a knock on the window. It turns out that what I had thought was someone knocking on our windows was in fact, a magpie seeing its reflection and trying to attack it."
BRANDON: Ah.
JULIA: I love a bird. That is so dumb.
BRANDON: Magpies are so silly.
JULIA: Oh, they're so dumb. I love them so much.
AMANDA: "If you didn't know, Australian magpies in particular are very territorial, and they're known for attacking anything that gets too close to its babies. This particular magpie tends to hang around our house and will attack any window with its reflection. I probably sometimes mistake the banging on the windows for doors as well just with echoes and how this house is." Probably. "If not, it's probably one of the several non-malicious spirits sharing the space with my family."
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: As always, Rowan, you can't leave a little line like that and not update us, so we—
JULIA: We gotta.
AMANDA: —we're gonna have to hear more about those other spirits, please.
BRANDON: Rowan, I'm gonna suggest as— you have two sound designers on this podcast, I'm going to suggest—
JULIA: Sure.
BRANDON: —you download some door sound effects, some door knocking, and then—
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: —window knocking, and train your ear to hear the difference.
AMANDA: Hmm.
BRANDON: And then tell us whether that's actually a magpie or a magpie and a ghost, because I do need to know.
AMANDA: It's good.
JULIA: Have we considered, have we considered ghost of a magpie?
BRANDON: We have not.
JULIA: Magpie long ago got stuck in house.
AMANDA: Yeah.
JULIA: Now, it's trying to get out and goes bang, bang, bang on door— or bang, bang, bang on window.
BRANDON: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
AMANDA: Yeah. And instead of attacking its reflection, it is just attacking the door and trying to get out.
JULIA: Oh, sad.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: A little sad, but also, like, consider. It's possible.
AMANDA: I do like the idea of a ghost bird, very chaotic, very cute.
JULIA: Ghost bird.
BRANDON: I would love to have a ghost bird as a pet. That'd be tight as hell.
JULIA: Ghost bird. I mean, Brandon, you're almost there. Brandon has been befriending crows on his apartment building and—
AMANDA: Exactly.
JULIA: —someday, man, you might have ghost crow friends.
BRANDON: I mean, that— that day when we were recording JTP and, like, 7 of them showed up at once, it was kind of terrifying, so—
JULIA: Uh-huh. Uh-huh. I heard the coffee ghosts cackle from very far away.
AMANDA: We were like, "What's happening?" And Brandon comes back, he's like, "There is 7 crows on my roof."
JULIA: So many crows.
AMANDA: Alright. So that was Rowan, and this was a Hometown Urban Legends episode. Brandon, thank you so much for joining us.
JULIA: Yay!
BRANDON: Wee! Thank you for having me. I am just realizing, also, that I do have a very strong urban legend that I do need to bring to you all, that I will need to do some research and reading back on.
JULIA: I would love that.
AMANDA: Love it.
JULIA: Give us a little tease.
BRANDON: So I'm trying to remember the exact name, but there was a family, I believe it was called like the Motley, which seems too convenient.
JULIA: Hmm.
BRANDON: But they had, like, a house that was kind of out in the middle of nowhere.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: Like, there were no other houses around.
AMANDA: Texas, sounds normal.
JULIA: Uh-hmm.
BRANDON: Yeah.
JULIA: Was there a cave system attached to the house?
BRANDON: There was not. But we did have, Julia, was a graveyard in front of their house.
JULIA: Huh.
BRANDON: A family graveyard. And—
JULIA: Classic.
AMANDA: Sure.
BRANDON: —there were lots of rumors about what was buried in that graveyard, so I'll have to tell you the full tale.
JULIA: Incredible. Brandon, thank you so much. If people want to find you and what you do on the internet, I know you don't exist a lot on social media, but where can they find it?
BRANDON: I'm a social media ghost.
JULIA: Social media ghost. Where can they find your stuff, though?
BRANDON: You can listen to Join the Party, that's where me, and Julia, and Amanda are all on. And otherwise, listen to other Multitude shows. And also check out stuff by one Lauren Shippen.
JULIA: Is that— who is that Brandon?
AMANDA: I wonder if there's any relation that haunts your house.
JULIA: Is that— is that the coffee ghost?
BRANDON: It is a ghost that— that haunts my house and also speaks— what's the name of the dot, dot language?
AMANDA: Morse code.
JULIA: Morse code? The dot, dot language?
AMANDA: Alright. That's staying in. That's good, that's good.
JULIA: Oh, yeah.
BRANDON: On a show called Breaker Whiskey, go check that out.
JULIA: I was about to say, the coffee ghost just put out a new show called Breaker Whiskey, It's very good, go check it out.
BRANDON: Yeah.
AMANDA: And if you enjoy audio hauntings, I gotta say, gotta listen to Join the Party. The theme song of our current campaign which Brandon wrote the music to, and Eric with the words to, and Julia sings on, is incredibly good and haunting, and will get stuck in your head, which is a kind of haunting if you think about it.
JULIA: Yeah.
BRANDON: Hell yeah.
JULIA: If you like spooky sea shanties.
AMANDA: We got you. Well, Brandon, thank you so much for joining us. And everybody, when you hear ghosts birds knocking on the inside of your walls—
JULIA: Stay creepy.
AMANDA: —stay cool.
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